#archiveteam-bs 2017-12-23,Sat

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Time Nickname Message
00:00 πŸ”— icedice Hey ez, are you sure hosting on Marshall Islands is even a thing? Nothing on https://www.peeringdb.com/advanced_search , http://www.datacentermap.com/datacenters.html , and the very few Marshall Islands web hosts listed on Google just seems to be based in the Marshall Islands and rent servers in the US.
00:01 πŸ”— icedice They can't even maintain their own TLD: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.mh
00:02 πŸ”— JAA icedice: #archiveteam for announcements, #archiveteam-bs for lengthy archival-related discussions, #archiveteam-ot for anything else.
00:02 πŸ”— icedice https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_in_the_Marshall_Islands#Internet
00:02 πŸ”— icedice ok
00:02 πŸ”— icedice moving the discussion there
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00:22 πŸ”— jacketcha You should try to host on Kahoolawe if you're looking for a far away island
00:22 πŸ”— jacketcha I'm pretty sure there are a few hundred people there
00:22 πŸ”— jacketcha Don't mind the radiation
00:25 πŸ”— icedice I'm guessing the US nuked the shit out of that and the inhabitants now glow in the dark
00:26 πŸ”— jacketcha Probably
00:26 πŸ”— jacketcha I think I have some relatives there
00:26 πŸ”— jacketcha If not there, try Mauna Kea
00:26 πŸ”— jacketcha You can power your servers with hundreds of peltier devices
00:26 πŸ”— icedice Sure, get them to set up a box that connects via satellite and we have a web host :P
00:27 πŸ”— jacketcha Don't even need a satellite
00:27 πŸ”— jacketcha Hawaii is one of the chokepoints of the internet, kinda like Norway
00:27 πŸ”— icedice Ah, right
00:28 πŸ”— jacketcha And yet, Hawaiian Telcom STILL can't get their modems to have a normal settings page with port forwarding
00:28 πŸ”— Valentin- has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
00:28 πŸ”— icedice My friend and I are currently hosted in a DMCA free data center in Luxembourg
00:29 πŸ”— jacketcha Just be careful, Germany is getting nationalistic again
00:30 πŸ”— icedice (We have an ad free non-profit fansite that hosts some stuff that is long out of print, but still copyrighted, as well as some newer stuff)
00:31 πŸ”— ez icedice: luxembourg implemented EUCD in 2004
00:31 πŸ”— ez if anybody tells you otherwise, its marketing BS
00:31 πŸ”— icedice It's DMCA free though
00:31 πŸ”— ez DMCA applies only to US
00:32 πŸ”— ez anywhere in EU, you have EUCD
00:32 πŸ”— icedice Any request would have come via Luxembourg's legal system
00:32 πŸ”— ez except for perhaps switzerland, which has its own process for copyright strikes
00:32 πŸ”— icedice Yeah, but lots of foreign web hosts still obey and enforce DMCA
00:32 πŸ”— jacketcha We have strict copyright, but at least we have good fair use laws that nobody listens to except the people protected by it.
00:32 πŸ”— jacketcha Rest in peace fair dealing
00:33 πŸ”— icedice Anyway, the people owning the copyright most likely know we exist and we have never gotten a legal notice from them
00:33 πŸ”— JAA #archiveteam-ot please.
00:34 πŸ”— icedice Hell, two people from those companies even use the site
00:34 πŸ”— icedice I'll stop now
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00:34 πŸ”— jacketcha Now that's what you call good public and private relations
00:46 πŸ”— jacketcha Hey, how many of you have seen https://pastebin.com/rFAgdLWD
00:46 πŸ”— jacketcha It's one of the top trending pastes right now
00:48 πŸ”— jacketcha And I think they pulled it off
00:48 πŸ”— jacketcha oh well
00:49 πŸ”— JAA Still works for me.
00:50 πŸ”— JAA Ah you mean that.
00:50 πŸ”— jacketcha But bitcoin is taking one of the biggest hits
00:50 πŸ”— JAA Meh, the decay started earlier than that, didn't it?
00:50 πŸ”— jacketcha No, this is the second time I've seen this paste
00:50 πŸ”— JAA Hm
00:50 πŸ”— jacketcha the first one was seen by way more people
00:50 πŸ”— jacketcha I think they're trying to kill the bubble
00:50 πŸ”— JAA The date is interesting for sure.
00:51 πŸ”— jacketcha Yeah, it started going down around wednesday
00:52 πŸ”— jacketcha I think my archiving extension grabbed the first one
00:52 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: i've seen better
00:52 πŸ”— ez https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/277984429081624577/393814757766987786/1lciqvoynf501.png
00:52 πŸ”— ez arguably one of the best bitcoin memes atm
00:53 πŸ”— JAA Hehe
00:53 πŸ”— jacketcha lmao
00:54 πŸ”— JAA jacketcha: Nope, started earlier than that as well. Business Insider's markets tool has the maximum on Sunday.
00:54 πŸ”— JAA http://markets.businessinsider.com/currencies/BTC-USD
00:54 πŸ”— JAA Can't seem to extract the accurate timestamp from that though.
00:55 πŸ”— JAA And the stronger decay started around Tuesday.
00:55 πŸ”— jacketcha Yeah, I'm on bitcoin.com right now for their charts
00:56 πŸ”— jacketcha At this rate, they'll be able to sell bitcoin for the steam holiday sale soon.
00:57 πŸ”— JAA Ah, that's just daily rates, right.
00:57 πŸ”— jacketcha Yeah
00:57 πŸ”— jacketcha I need to start logging it every 10 seconds
00:59 πŸ”— JAA I want to do statistical analysis on that, like determining when the exponential growth of the last few months was first deviated from statistically significantly.
01:00 πŸ”— JAA Anyway, getting off-topicy again.
01:01 πŸ”— jacketcha yeah
01:02 πŸ”— jacketcha Does the internet archive keep a copy of bitcoin's price though?
01:03 πŸ”— jacketcha I think I'll set that up
01:03 πŸ”— jacketcha should be pretty easy
01:06 πŸ”— jacketcha around every 30 seconds should be fine, right?
01:14 πŸ”— jacketcha done
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01:25 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: theres no singular "bitcoin price". there are archives of individual trade feeds, though - https://bitcoincharts.com/about/markets-api/
01:25 πŸ”— ez all the markets are very shallow/high spread so its difficult to establish a precise price at any given moment
01:30 πŸ”— jacketcha Of course there is no single price for bitcoin, such as there is no single price for bread. There is a common range of prices, and very big cryotocurrency market places though that report their price. I am using bitcointicker.co for my price origin right now\
01:31 πŸ”— ez yea, that just displays the feed
01:32 πŸ”— ez what i mean that if you want to mirror historical data, just mirror bitcoincharts feed for history, and then you're better off pulling the exchange api yourself
01:32 πŸ”— ez screenshotting any given website will give you very inaccurate/out of context (meaning: useless) data
01:33 πŸ”— jacketcha True, I'll take that into the script
01:33 πŸ”— jacketcha Would it be even better to take multiple sources as well, not just bitcoincharts?
01:34 πŸ”— ez bitcoincharts is the only one giving out public history, but they themselves generally discourage using their live feed
01:34 πŸ”— ez the site is often quite overloaded as p much all trade bots are pointed at it
01:35 πŸ”— ez (meaning, bitcoincharts is *the* archive of historical price, but it would be nice to have another one)
01:36 πŸ”— jacketcha I'll look into that
01:37 πŸ”— ez if there was something archiving bid/ask orderbooks as well, that would be really nice, as far i know nobody archives that
01:37 πŸ”— ez but its generally important metric on the depth of the market through history
01:37 πŸ”— jacketcha Well, thanks random fearmongering paste, now I have a winter break project\
01:38 πŸ”— ez the paste is so ridiculous i suppose thats why its shared. of ridiculous cryptocurrency shaenigan pastes, this one takes the crown https://pastebin.com/CcGUBgDG
01:38 πŸ”— ez while fake, i really wish it was real
01:40 πŸ”— jacketcha protip: if you want to look serious when baiting, sign your message with pgp
01:41 πŸ”— jacketcha You know, with pastebin getting around 2 pastes per second, I wouldn't doubt that the majority of all human knowledge has made it in there
01:42 πŸ”— ez pastebin would probably deserve some sort of archive bot, yea
01:43 πŸ”— ez archiving it amounts to archiving 4chan though, the bot operator would have to constantly deal with the same legal takedown barrage pastebin gets
01:43 πŸ”— jacketcha I have an idea
01:43 πŸ”— godane so i found my last recorded vhs
01:43 πŸ”— ez perhaps keep the archive log delayed/darked for a year or so, and then publish it
01:44 πŸ”— jacketcha Encrypt each paste and wait for its copyright to expire, then decrypt it
01:44 πŸ”— ez nobody generally gives a shit about what was going on before
01:44 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: copyright?
01:44 πŸ”— godane its has dust on the top but has no white mold
01:44 πŸ”— ez its rarely about copyright
01:44 πŸ”— ez just the usual - slander, harassment, dox and stuff
01:44 πŸ”— ez is what disappears from pastebin pronto
01:44 πŸ”— ez also leaked passwords and what not
01:44 πŸ”— jacketcha good point
01:45 πŸ”— jacketcha ive made somewhat of an effort to archive at least the new pastes
01:45 πŸ”— jacketcha using the liveweb feature
01:46 πŸ”— ez pastebin are real asses about scraping
01:46 πŸ”— ez they have pay-to-scrape api
01:46 πŸ”— jacketcha ikr
01:47 πŸ”— ez and public scraping is limited, you cant hammer it at the rate new pastes appear sadly
01:47 πŸ”— ez needs to cycle at least 10 or so proxies
01:47 πŸ”— jacketcha So, I made a chrome extension that is basically the equivalent of !ao, but it runs on every page you visit
01:47 πŸ”— jacketcha and i get banned from pastebin
01:47 πŸ”— jacketcha alot
01:47 πŸ”— jacketcha Good thing VPNs exist
01:49 πŸ”— JAA I think joepie91 was looking into Pastebin archival with that previously mentioned $$$ API a while back.
01:50 πŸ”— ez depends whats worth more, $20 for scrape pass, or your time to make your script proxy aware
01:50 πŸ”— jacketcha I'm broke, so I'll take proxy aware
01:50 πŸ”— jacketcha At least multiple people can run it then
01:51 πŸ”— jacketcha as long as they know how to install node packages
01:52 πŸ”— ez i'd first check if they dont ban tor already tho
01:52 πŸ”— ez as tor is one of the few rare "legit" proxies, any other proxy is shady one way or another
01:53 πŸ”— jacketcha i wonder if i can just use IFTTT
01:53 πŸ”— jacketcha they're a big name
01:53 πŸ”— jacketcha and it's easy to use them as a proxy as long as you don't expect a response
01:54 πŸ”— ez yes, ifttt can make http requests
01:55 πŸ”— ez these tools are incredibly cumbersome for anything serious, even as simple as scraping pastebin
01:55 πŸ”— jacketcha yeah
01:55 πŸ”— jacketcha wait
01:55 πŸ”— jacketcha does the internet archive use a proxy while using liveweb?
01:55 πŸ”— JAA Don't.
01:55 πŸ”— JAA :-P
01:55 πŸ”— ez why would they?
01:56 πŸ”— ez the crawler uses ia ips, if thats what youre asking
01:56 πŸ”— jacketcha alright, because most of my crawlers use liveweb, because me too poor to afford a dedicated server for warc storage, and me too stupid to learn how to use google drive api
01:56 πŸ”— ez hmm, im not sure what save page extension actually does
01:57 πŸ”— ez i imagine it would be simpler to just save whats already downloaded by the client
01:57 πŸ”— jacketcha it saves the page without resources
01:57 πŸ”— ez even if that introduces trust issues
01:57 πŸ”— JAA I wrote a little script for peeking into WARC files without having to decompress the entire file, in case anyone's interested: https://github.com/JustAnotherArchivist/warc-peek
01:58 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: google drive is too pricey anyway
01:58 πŸ”— jacketcha nah, i got a school account
01:58 πŸ”— ez ah
01:58 πŸ”— JAA I thought those extensions just open web.archive.org/save/<current URL>. But there are several, and I don't know all of them.
01:58 πŸ”— jacketcha they do
01:58 πŸ”— jacketcha but mine just makes a get request
01:58 πŸ”— JAA Anything else would be pretty dangerous really.
01:59 πŸ”— JAA Dangerous for the integrity of the archive, that is.
01:59 πŸ”— jacketcha https://github.com/jacket-chan/auto-archive-extension
01:59 πŸ”— JAA Ah :-|
01:59 πŸ”— ez JAA: on another hand, it would allow for archiving walled content
01:59 πŸ”— ez but as you said, trust issues
01:59 πŸ”— jacketcha good point
01:59 πŸ”— JAA Yeah
01:59 πŸ”— jacketcha i think im gonna reverse engineer how WARCreate works and just steal that
01:59 πŸ”— jacketcha thank god for open source
02:00 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: theres also archive.is you can abuse for this too
02:00 πŸ”— ez archive.is is slightly better as it seems to run true headless browser, while ia archives seem wonky
02:00 πŸ”— jacketcha true
02:00 πŸ”— ez tho not sure about save page, im judging by public crawls
02:01 πŸ”— jacketcha I used that for archiving 4chan pages before I knew about archiveteam
02:01 πŸ”— jacketcha just archive the archive.is page and you're good to go
02:01 πŸ”— JAA The save page "just" serves the live page, attempting to rewrite every URL it can find to web.archive.org/save/...
02:02 πŸ”— JAA That works well for many things and not so well for just as many things.
02:02 πŸ”— JAA In particular 99% of JS-based requests will probably fail.
02:02 πŸ”— jacketcha That sounds eerily similar to what I would have done
02:02 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: 4chan got its own fleet of mirrors
02:02 πŸ”— ez no need to save threads
02:02 πŸ”— jacketcha true\
02:03 πŸ”— jacketcha but they're all blocked for when I want to read greentext in the middle of infotech
02:03 πŸ”— ez tho no mirror is as crazy to keep all the pictures iirc
02:03 πŸ”— ez i know the guy who runs 4plebs
02:03 πŸ”— jacketcha doesn't 4chan upload the images to imgur?
02:03 πŸ”— ez and its like, 40tb just the thumbnails
02:03 πŸ”— jacketcha oof
02:03 πŸ”— JAA s/crazy/ambitious/
02:04 πŸ”— JAA ;-)
02:04 πŸ”— JAA Look at us, we were trying to save 1.4 PB of Vidme videos. :-P
02:04 πŸ”— jacketcha lol
02:05 πŸ”— jacketcha so me and my friend at school decided at the beginning of the year we're going to race to fill our google drive accounts with one petabyte
02:05 πŸ”— jacketcha and I got 6.1tb in before I got contacted by IFTTT because I had made more than a million requests per hour to the google drive API using their service
02:06 πŸ”— JAA That sounds... inefficient.
02:06 πŸ”— jacketcha extremely
02:06 πŸ”— jacketcha but, as I said before,
02:07 πŸ”— JAA Just use Beaston02's scripts if you're serious about that challenge. That should get it done in a few weeks or so.
02:07 πŸ”— * jacketcha is too stupid to learn how to use any of Google's APIs and OAuth
02:07 πŸ”— ez JAA: 4chan is far bigger than, sadly.
02:07 πŸ”— ez 400GB a month
02:07 πŸ”— ez thats after deduping
02:07 πŸ”— JAA (That's the guy who hoarded > 1 PB of webcam porn on Amazon Drive until they discontinued the unlimited plan.)
02:07 πŸ”— jacketcha lmao I remember that
02:08 πŸ”— ez JAA: ouch
02:08 πŸ”— JAA ez: Uh, that doesn't sound right.
02:08 πŸ”— JAA 14 years * 12 months per year * 400 GB per month = ~67 TB
02:08 πŸ”— ez JAA: thats just one, but most active board
02:09 πŸ”— jacketcha is that /b/, /pol/, or /r9k/
02:09 πŸ”— ez pol, but b and r9k together are archived too
02:09 πŸ”— ez and tehy together are probably as big as pol
02:10 πŸ”— jacketcha wait, /pol/ is bigger than /b/?
02:10 πŸ”— JAA jacketcha: The AT wiki has a nice compilation of the 4chan mirrors by the way.
02:10 πŸ”— ez i dont have numbers for the rest, but taken together 4chan should be something to the tune of 2TB a month
02:11 πŸ”— ez jacketcha: by far. only as recent tho
02:11 πŸ”— JAA So ~300 TB total for the past 14 years (at most, as it was probably less active in the early days?). That's big, but not *that* big.
02:11 πŸ”— jacketcha not CERN "hey if you want to download collision data here's the link" on twitter big
02:12 πŸ”— ez JAA: just thumbnails. nobody really knows number for full scrape as nobody archives those for longer than a year
02:12 πŸ”— JAA Oh, I see.
02:13 πŸ”— jacketcha I'm surprised this isn't one of the biggest targets, seeing how 4chan is probably on some of the shakiest grounds known to any site, but is the birthplace of memes.
02:14 πŸ”— JAA Shouldn't be too hard to scrape a few thousand threads and estimate total size from that.
02:14 πŸ”— ez hm, 4plebs apparently doesnt have archive.moe archives
02:14 πŸ”— ez guess it would be nice to start mirroring the boards somewhat more consistently
02:14 πŸ”— ez all the archives seem to be truncated to between 1-4 years
02:15 πŸ”— jacketcha yeah
02:16 πŸ”— ez archive.moe was huge, like 10TB and seems to be still lost
02:17 πŸ”— jacketcha i wonder if it could be pieced together with the cache of really old computers
02:17 πŸ”— ez 2015-09-19 4plebs Purge (Archived!) - Removing full images older than 18 months (before April 2014) as of September, 2015, due to low storage space. Obtained the data, now working to upload the whole set to the Internet Archive.
02:17 πŸ”— ez oh
02:17 πŸ”— ez so thats why
02:17 πŸ”— ez they dumped their full sizes to IA
02:17 πŸ”— jacketcha oh
02:18 πŸ”— jacketcha So, is the IA just the cold storage unit of the internet?
02:18 πŸ”— ez p much
02:18 πŸ”— jacketcha like, even I do that sometimes
02:19 πŸ”— jacketcha upload a file to a temp file host like uguu.se and just archive the file
02:19 πŸ”— jacketcha then bam, instant file hosting
02:23 πŸ”— jacketcha So, is the archiveteam twitter dead?
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03:18 πŸ”— jacketcha Hey, where is the logs of the IRCs stored? Because I can guarentee that the logs of a channel for archivists will definitely be kept somewhere
03:23 πŸ”— JAA https://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=IRC#IRC_Logs
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03:23 πŸ”— jacketcha Thank you
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04:02 πŸ”— swebb sets mode: +o underscor
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05:20 πŸ”— godane so i may have ton of buffy episodes from season 6
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05:20 πŸ”— godane WOC episodes
06:06 πŸ”— godane SketchCow: so i maybe able to fix the gap of buffy episodes that was taped over in your boxes
06:07 πŸ”— godane my one last tape has S06E04 to S06E07 so far
06:07 πŸ”— godane that tape you had was label to have S06E06 to S06E12
06:07 πŸ”— godane but it was all taped over but part of S06E12 at the end of tape
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08:30 πŸ”— godane do we have that: https://thepiratebay.org/torrent/18471513/The_Journal_of_Organic_Chemistry_(JOC)[1936-2017]_upd_20.08.2017
08:51 πŸ”— ez which reminds me
08:51 πŸ”— ez suppose there was a way to get hands on huge stash of sci-hub scrapes
08:52 πŸ”— ez how exactly one goes about getting those into IA?
08:52 πŸ”— ez those would indeed need to be darked immediately, springler would send their law ninjas immediately otherwise
08:55 πŸ”— schbirid you mean the papers? would be great to spread them amongst everyone with some kind of anonymous collection sharing thingies
08:55 πŸ”— ez its been tried before
08:55 πŸ”— ez it didnt work well
08:55 πŸ”— ez these collections are really huge
08:57 πŸ”— ez schbirid: https://sites.google.com/site/themetalibrary/library-genesis ... libgen is a lot like AT
08:57 πŸ”— ez just more rawwr, piratey
09:00 πŸ”— schbirid yeah the torrents are not well seeded :(
09:01 πŸ”— ez ideally it would be nice to have ia as seed
09:02 πŸ”— ez for as long as possible
09:03 πŸ”— schbirid not gonna happen
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09:06 πŸ”— Harzilein some day i'd like to make a proposal for nntp seeds ;)
09:06 πŸ”— Harzilein libgen used to be posted to usenet, but apparently that stopped somewhere in the 700k range
09:09 πŸ”— ez yea, its sort of a problem finding home for all of that
09:09 πŸ”— ez but its kinda radioactive, being sci-hub affiliated and all
09:10 πŸ”— ez you cant post on usenet at this rate, especially not at the pace of sci-hub scrapes
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10:46 πŸ”— swebb sets mode: +o underscor
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11:36 πŸ”— Igloo Anyone else having issues with uploading to FOS?
11:38 πŸ”— jacketcha I'm going to pretend I know what that stands for even though it is probably something very obvious.
11:38 πŸ”— jacketcha Yes.
11:38 πŸ”— Igloo DNS lookup fos.textfiles.com
11:39 πŸ”— jacketcha no dns records or txt records
11:39 πŸ”— jacketcha runs ubuntu
11:40 πŸ”— jacketcha ssh 2.0
11:40 πŸ”— jacketcha and seems to be related to the internet archive and archiveteam]
11:40 πŸ”— jacketcha so probably important
11:40 πŸ”— Igloo Name: fortressofsolitude.textfiles.com
11:40 πŸ”— jacketcha oh
11:40 πŸ”— Igloo It's an ingress point for a lot of our "stuff"
11:40 πŸ”— jacketcha cool name
11:42 πŸ”— jacketcha what's as7941?
11:42 πŸ”— Igloo BGP AS number
11:43 πŸ”— jacketcha Interesting
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12:27 πŸ”— jacketcha oh wow it's 2:26 in the morning
12:27 πŸ”— jacketcha I should probably go to bed
12:27 πŸ”— jacketcha gn
13:31 πŸ”— joepie91 JAA: ez: jacketcha: https://pastebin-stream.cryto.net/
13:36 πŸ”— JAA Nice!
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14:38 πŸ”— schbirid https://www.reddit.com/r/DataHoarder/comments/7lkwx6/over_2tib_of_old_scene_game_releases_now_complete/
14:52 πŸ”— Laverne nice. Grabbing it now, thanks for linking
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15:05 πŸ”— SketchCow FOS should be up
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17:39 πŸ”— ez joepie91: neat
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17:53 πŸ”— JAA Who runs purplebot (the bot that announces wiki changes in here)? PurpleSym? I just noticed that my changes to the Blog.pl page from yesterday didn't get mentioned here. Perhaps something broke due to the server upgrades? (Cc jrwr)
17:54 πŸ”— PurpleSym JAA: Yep, that’s mine as well. And yes, the wiki update seems to have killed it. I’ll have a look.
17:54 πŸ”— JAA Thanks
18:11 πŸ”— PurpleSym Huh, for some reason python-requests double-encodes the pipe character in request parameters: https://www.archiveteam.org/api.php?action=query&rcdir=older&format=json&continue=&rcend=1513853996&rcnamespace=0%257C6&rcprop=user%257Ccomment%257Ctimestamp%257Csizes%257Ctitle%257Cflags%257Cids%257Cloginfo&rclimit=500&list=recentchanges
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19:25 πŸ”— godane SketchCow: i'm uploading 10gb of qvc japan i capture over the last few days
19:25 πŸ”— godane also please don't upload the /QVC Japan/2017-12 folder until i tell you too
19:26 πŸ”— godane mostly cause i may lose power during my uploading
19:26 πŸ”— godane everything but that folder is uploaded
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21:08 πŸ”— JAA jrwr: svchost01 is having a stroke. ^
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