[02:47] Famicoman: ping [06:03] In America, government hacks you... http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2013/01/22/roll-your-sleeves-get-involved-and-get-civic-hacking [06:04] or as Andrew Auernheimer @rabite says, "If your app is deemed unamerican you go to prison!" [06:05] Good ol' weev [06:39] fuck [06:40] media is pushing a story of john kerry saying hackers are nukes [06:41] http://activepolitic.com:82/external/1785.html [06:41] 00:12 <+u4t> imagine if a hacker had been dropped on hiroshima or nagasaki [06:41] 00:12 <+u4t> there would be NO SURVIVORS [06:47] hahaha [06:47] well, admittedly, our shit is so fucking vulnerable [06:50] can't we all just get along? [07:16] [07:16] oops [07:17] [07:17] [07:17] [07:31] thinking a lot about the "bubble" window-period of lots of semi-freely available information due to the CD-ROM/DVD-ROM era of distribution... we get this big explosion of INFORMATION availability and then in a couple decades it seems like that access is less available. Is all the info still there like it was 15 years ago? [07:31] What the heck is this publication? http://www.worldcat.org/title/canadian-cd-rom-newsletter/oclc/18111186 [07:34] If every CD-ROM is now a web site... where is the site, "The rock cycle in Michigan" lol -- http://www.worldcat.org/title/rock-cycle-in-michigan-cd-rom/oclc/49221323 [07:35] oh, I guess this is it... https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CD0QFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.oakland.k12.mi.us%2Fscope%2Fseventh_lessons%2Fscience%2Funit5%2FSC070504TB.ppt&ei=G4cDUaHoEMSQqgHejoCQDg&usg=AFQjCNEsym5C44QZ3CC9eyKiLWcxmiXZTg&sig2=32aCcKoVhvrMHq_CCDrBCA&bvm=bv.41524429,d.aWM [07:35] just for you guys to know i download g4tv.com videos [07:36] should have linked: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CEEQxQEwAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fviewer%3Fa%3Dv%26q%3Dcache%3A_OwfKzETh84J%3Awww.oakland.k12.mi.us%2Fscope%2Fseventh_lessons%2Fscience%2Funit5%2FSC070504TB.ppt%2B%26hl%3Den%26gl%3Dus%26pid%3Dbl%26srcid%3DADGEESglvcHQH5V5tU6eFA2ZTt2-Ddh9wo-lL-DrtMVCnDKHMa4ELCoNRUdpLh0Sh-EQGoNT1RTJ-LYACtXu9 [07:36] Geeze godane1-- made me think I was posting in the non -bs page. something meaningful? :) [07:37] balrog_: http://archive.org/details/AaronSwartzMemorial0 [07:39] i left the original video titles because i wanted to keep it as close to the original format as possible [07:39] all that has changed is the container from flv to mp4 [07:40] hmm that newsletter is in the vancouver public library, not so far [07:41] doesn't sound like it necessarily has an enclosed disc though [07:47] http://archive.org/details/AaronSwartzMemorialAtTheInternetArchive [07:59] authoritarians! [08:26] DFJustin-- these days I'm thinking I should take a cd-reader into any large local library to do archiving sessions. I doubt they will keep those discs for ten+, or twenty+ years. [08:27] yeah go for it [08:27] cds rot eventually too [08:47] thanks for uploading the memorial... am watching... good thoughts. [08:49] 29m05s+ "if you are a programmer or technologist like many of you in the audience today, you have special powers and special responsibilities..." [08:50] "... you can do magic" [08:51] abt 29m15s+ "Aaron really could do magic. And I'm dedicated to making sure his magic doesn't end with his death. I hope you'll join me" -- missed her name, Aaron's girlfriend. [08:52] Sobering stuff. [08:52] turnkit: very inspiring [08:58] Taren\ [08:59] SketchCow: I'm mirroring the g4 videos on g4tv.com [08:59] i have the list [08:59] getting tons of old techtv videos [09:01] in other news i have a mcdonalds employee training video from 1972 [09:01] training video is neat [09:01] b/c of the age and the format [09:01] and iconic source [09:01] and i'm getting a blockbuster employee training from 2002 [09:02] I've got some Tandy training LASERDISC but it's from like 1992 -- not nearly as cool. haha. :) [09:02] category: CorporateTraining -? [09:03] what are you using to digitize? [09:06] Whoever was involved in shooting the Internet Archive memorial did a very nice job. Multi-cam shoot with good establishing shots. Nothing overdone, simple, but live-edited well. [09:07] turnkit: i just find stuff on the web [09:07] you mean, not on youtube? [09:07] :) [09:08] have you heard the 1800-sos-apple phone tech support calls collection? [09:08] it's like only 10 calls [09:08] some apple IIe and Mac+ type era calls [09:09] I think I found them on DSLreports.com again... someone uploaded them to their forum (that's a good forum/site to archive btw) [09:09] http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r12697522-humor-Apple-Support-Calls [09:09] weird old stuff... [09:12] http://blog.greenpirate.org/aaronz-swartz-memorials-archived/ [09:19] #1 weird old trick for fixing your IIe [09:25] just realized there is not much chat going on b/c it's friday night at 3:30 AM. someone has a life? [09:28] http://archive.org/details/AaronSwartzMemorialAtTheInternetArchive [09:29] 56m -- Tim O'Reilly makes sobering statements about being formed by the things that "defeat" us. Enjoying these talks. Feels like a good church service. [09:30] i'm in the same time zone turnkit [09:30] yeah that was a great one [09:31] East Texas here. [09:31] Ausint [09:31] -t [09:31] or put it somewhere more appropriate anyway :D [09:31] you guys have a DC meet or 2600 down there? [09:32] t is playing leapfrog [09:32] hm i don't know if they have 2600 [09:32] yes of course [09:32] http://www.meetup.com/ATX-2600/ [09:32] would have been surprised if not [09:32] Dallas has an interesting DC group , but I hate driving an hour+ each way [09:32] ah [09:33] I'm near Tyler [09:33] podunk out here but I like it [09:34] :) [09:34] as long as you have internets i guess [09:34] priorities [09:34] Tyler has Suddenlink's nationwide VOIP control/termination I think. They have a good network but I'm out in the countryside with AT&T DSL [09:34] 3mb/s and am trying to game the system to get 6 which is technically possible but for some reason has been a big battle. [09:35] there's a dungeons and dragons meetup too [09:35] no time for that unfortunately [09:35] lulzies. we have a "Game Board Geek" store in town [09:35] I play Settlers but not most of the games they have there. [09:36] i literally just upgraded from 3mbps [09:36] congrats. I know your pain. lol [09:36] :) [09:36] at&t was charging about $50 per month for that [09:36] yep [09:36] because we had signed a year deal or whatever [09:37] what service providers do you havei n Austin? [09:37] at least we were able to get a new year deal for slightly better speeds [09:37] at&t and time warner [09:37] who i would never use [09:37] so what/who do you have now? [09:37] in this area anyway [09:37] at&t still [09:38] i dunno [09:38] i might like to move to sweden for some time [09:38] did you ever get notices on datacaps? [09:38] not that i know of [09:38] I think ATT has them, but are not implimented in our area - thank goodness [09:39] it's like 150GB or 250GB per month, I can't remember [09:39] I've been meaning to update since this http://blog.greenpirate.org/comcast-data-caps-how-long-to-reach-your-cap/ [09:39] i think they upped it to 350GB, not sure [09:39] I'll switch to business class as soon as they impliment here if I get close to it. Business doesn't have a cap [09:39] but it's more expensive [09:40] http://muninetworks.org/content/bandwidth-caps-are-unnecessary-and-counterproductive [09:40] there's a good twit.tv special on datacaps -- guys from ISP Hurricane Electric (I think that's their name) [09:41] nice [09:41] yeah - peak congestion is the real problem - not overall capping [09:41] at least in our market [09:44] I am somewhat suspicious AT&T is purposely selling lower speeds than they can in order to push purchasing of data plans over mobile. [09:45] it's crazy but Verizon is about 15 miles from me too and they have purposefully not deployed DSL. Their rep came out to our counry town to tell a group interested in DSL that it would never come but 4G data would "in the future" -- guess which make more money for Verizon? [09:45] So I wonder if ATT isn't motivated the same way [09:47] actually they are tho [09:47] and they are cutting unlimited plans for mobile [09:48] oh man i left them because of that [09:48] they give some small amount of bandwidth [09:48] and if you hit it, another $20 fee each time [09:48] i wasn't even using it and somehow hitting it from crappy apps or something [09:48] no idea why tbh [09:56] anyone know how to play an archive.org video starting right at a time code (like youtubes &t=0m0s)? [09:57] I want to post to FB Malamud's 82m40s+ Aaron Schwartz portion [09:57] what kind of video player do they use? [09:58] maybe you should suggest that feature [09:59] Don't know what they are using. But would be nice too if the timeline could be expanded to fill the screen for accurate scrubbing. A ninety minute video is hard to scrub on when it's shown in 4" of screen real estate. [09:59] well right now, in full screen the scrub is only 1/3 of the screen [10:01] the Malamud's talk should be re-up'd on it's own [10:02] it's so good [10:02] with energy [10:02] clear passion [10:02] but I like this guy already [10:02] so I'm biased [10:05] // Lossless flv/mp4 cutters? [10:09] turnkit: if you click on the animated gif thumbnail you get a bunch of thumbnail images with links to time codes [10:09] Thanks for the "feedback" suggestion [10:09] tweak as needed [10:09] I see where to do that [10:09] "We use the jwplayer from longtail video." [10:09] DFJustin - I'll check it. thx [10:11] well it added code, such as ?start=5009.5 at the end of the URL [10:12] ah -- the time code shows starting at "0" but when you hit play it pops forward. [10:12] THANKS [10:12] that works [10:19] I think the best hackers will never work for the gov for a number of reasons [10:20] resistance to authority figures [10:20] Mainly because the gov is a bunch of assholes [10:20] not being squeaky clean enough to work for them [10:20] etc ... [10:20] decitivive assholes [10:20] this bs to try to get us to help them will not work [10:20] If you don't feel you have time to watch the whole memorial watch the last part first... it might motivate you :) http://archive.org/details/AaronSwartzMemorialAtTheInternetArchive?start=4955 [10:21] haha -- yeah -- kids with life long authority issues / authorities with life long exploition and power trip issues -- the world is kinda f'd up [10:21] good luck getting them to enjoy eachother in a functional way [10:22] Also and I think the biggest reason is you have to play by their rules [10:23] and that is a fucking non-starter for me [10:23] When I do a security audit at a company they want me to bash everything in [10:23] The gov freaks out if you find something too unexpected because there were *rules* [10:23] haha -- yeah makes sense [10:24] uploaded: http://archive.org/details/McDonalds.Employee.Training.VHS.1972 [10:24] "control" is why they hire audits. when they discover less of it, they aren't feeling warm fuzzies [10:24] thanks godane, I really want to watch that video [10:25] Most of the hackers who I know are on the level are fucking kernel programmers for Linux and FreeBSD [10:25] hmm... McDonalds video -vs.- Malamud's talk @ Aaron Schwartz memorial? [10:25] Correct answer: both [10:25] the gov wouldn't pay them enough to come over [10:25] yeah I am a big fan of Malamud [10:26] he's awesome. I got his book on "the internet" from the 90's a couple years ago... I still need to finish... same issues different decade and different data [10:27] MickeyD is making me happy and gaayyyy... oh wait. [10:27] not really but if you listen to the song you'll know how I feel [10:27] :) [10:28] I need to dig up my copy of waiting and see how there fake training compares [10:28] man why does everyone have to rip vhs to mpeg-1, like it wasn't crap enough already [10:29] because the vhs conversion units usually spit out mpeg 1 or 2 [10:29] DFJustin: the g4tv.com videos may piss you off [10:29] my vhs reader dumps straight to dvd [10:29] I have an old Avid system... digitizes to Avid Meridien codec that nothing can use. So I'd have to transcode to something... and something thats compressed.... [10:29] a lot of full episodes 56k [10:30] Oh man, I got to the sad part in the McD video :( [10:30] I was so happy till "if I wanted frys I WOULD HAVE ASKED FOR T H E M ! !!!!@" [10:30] turnkit, you sure ffmpeg does not have support for that avid codec? They have support for the others like dnxhd [10:31] hmm... but the bandwidth is huge [10:31] I worked on a Fox SportsNet show in the early 2000's -- BluetorchTV (extreme sports) -- we MASTERED at 3:1 compression [10:32] Avid Meridien from that era could do what they called 1:1, 2:1, 3:1, 10:1 and 20:1 (and some single field codecs) [10:32] But it's a tought decision -- what compression should be used. [10:33] I'm glad that McD vid starts so happy... people are mean. [10:33] I'm hoping it will come full circle and the hero will win at the end. lol [10:34] Someone just started testing a robot that can make 350 burgers an hour [10:34] 1:1 avid footage for one hour: 185.3 GB. http://www.digitalrebellion.com/webapps/video_calc.html [10:34] the fast food jobs death clock has started [10:35] about 3GB/minute [10:35] that isn't so much "avid" footage as raw [10:35] Well that's what broadcast quality footage is... "uncompressed" -- aka "raw" [10:35] at 3:1 one minute is down to 260MB/minute... a lot more reasonable [10:36] were you guys doing 4:3 ratio or 16:9? [10:36] this was 2001 I think - all 4:3 [10:36] SD - NTSC [10:36] but if I want to archive something well... it's a tough call for me [10:37] I am so glad there are other video peeps in this group. [10:37] I'll probably compromise and do 3:1 or digitize 1:1 and then transcode to MP4 or AVC at a high bitrate [10:37] deinterlacing issues can make a mess [10:37] people don't understand it and then end up wanting to deinterlace everything which is a no-no [10:38] yep [10:39] but if you don't have a way to deinterlace on playback, then the footage looks bad [10:39] so what's the answer? [10:39] I think the footage has to be archived in it's native format [10:39] i have figured out the video names dates for the g4tv.com videos [10:39] and we have to work on output engines that render based on the device being used -- these days mostly in a progressive format [10:40] its YYMMDD [10:40] typical american dating style... so weird. :) [10:41] Man - I want a happy meal now [10:41] also for everyone at home keeping count i have 13.1Gb of g4tv.com videos [10:41] that's pretty good [10:42] bad news any file with vc# is going to end in a 404 [10:43] why is that? [10:44] dont know [10:44] bug in the scraper? [10:44] no [10:44] not on the server? [10:44] maybe [10:47] if you strip off the #vc can you manually dl? [10:47] oh, nevermind [10:47] doh [10:48] I read that wrong [10:48] its 404 on website page [10:48] http://www.g4tv.com/videos/1675//moby-interview/ [10:49] plus side is some of the vc videos i think are there but with normal names and different path [10:54] why don't all magazine publishers do this?:http://www.ebay.com/itm/National-Geographic-112-Years-32-CD-Rom-Set-Complete-Magazine-All-Issues-PC-Mac-/271101566054 [10:54] Even looks like the licensed the deal out to whatever company name is on the box... but at least they didn't sit on their assets. [10:56] that moby link just hangs for me... but I think all the g4tv video links are doing that... not sure why [10:57] I agree turnkit. I got fucking stacks of mags I keep for interesting bits but I wish they were digital. Time & Newsweek are two of the worst [10:58] well newsweek is dead in print now [10:59] is that new news? [10:59] Daily Beast ate them, no? [11:00] great quote from a 1994 CD-ROM review in the Seattle Times: "Angus' Law states that in any category, 85 percent is mediocre or less, 10 percent is just fine and 5 percent is excellent. The rash of CD-ROM titles conforms." [11:01] Some of that mediocrity is actually mineable though. [11:01] I still claim Sturgeon's Law [11:02] mainly because once you get exposed to really good content for a while a bunch of things you liked are now crap [11:13] omf__ - sorry I'm not reading well -- I skipped the highlighted line your replied to me in and just read the next as if it was the only thing your wrote [11:13] agreed. [11:13] Somebody has to digitize and license affordably. [11:14] Or just back off and let enthusiasts help the community of knowledge [11:19] I know this is obvious, but it is worth stating. The search capabilities enabled by having things digital is far more useful than most can imagine. [11:20] There are so many forever projects I had that are now possible because of data becoming free and things like internet archive and freebase [11:21] that is why JSTOR is such a cock tease. All online and searchable... just too fucking expensive for the 99% [12:00] google play downloading dashboard graph porn http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5117983 [13:23] omf__, turnkit, I'd argue for a modified version of Sturgeons Law: 90% of everything starts out as being crap, and this percentage increases over time [13:29] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvrPsBiZYaY [13:34] http://i.imgur.com/oPOidhn.gif [14:31] how would one mirror an entire site plus 1 level deep of external links? [14:31] using wget-warc [14:44] joepie91: Try wget-lua. [14:47] aside from me not speaking lua, does that do WARCs? [14:48] Yes, the warc thing is included in Wget 1.14, and wget-lua is based on the current wget git version. I'm making a little example script. [14:52] alright, thanks\ [14:53] https://gist.github.com/2c5bbbeec96979c84768 [14:53] wget-lua --recursive --page-requisites, but no --span-hosts [14:55] (Didn't try it.) [14:58] Yeah, keep a watch on the process by following the output (or output to a log and tail that) [15:02] The most recent Wget+Lua tar is here: http://warriorhq.archiveteam.org/downloads/wget-lua/ [15:03] or here: https://raw.github.com/ArchiveTeam/xanga-grab/master/get-wget-lua.sh [15:11] alard: doesn't that just do page assets though? [15:11] No, line 14-16 should accept any URL that is referred to from the original host. [15:12] start_url_parsed is the URL that you give to Wget on the command line. [15:12] parent is the URL where Wget found the current URL. [15:12] urlpos is the URL that Wget is considering. [15:13] So I think it should work, but do check it. [15:32] it seems to just be doing infinite recursion now [15:32] downloading half the internet [15:33] cc alard [15:33] Oh. [15:34] What are your Wget options? [15:34] ./wget-lua -t 2 --lua-script=../luascripts/externaldl.lua -e robots=off --wait 0.25 http://home.hccnet.nl/t.amerongen/ --mirror --warc-file=at-amerongen [15:35] actually I'm not sure [15:35] this guy may just haev a lot of outbound links [15:35] let me watch it for a bit longer [15:36] In the meantime, could you send an update of the seesaw-kit to pypi? [15:36] hm, have you updated the setup.py with the new version? [15:37] git doesn't indicate any changes to setup.py [15:37] oh right [15:37] that's defined elsewhere [15:38] never mind [15:38] Ah yes, I had to look it up, but the version isn't in setup.py. [15:39] ooh, it's tagged and all ^_^ [15:40] there we go, updated [15:40] pip install --upgrade seesaw-kit [15:40] to update [15:40] Connecting to www.imageshack.us|208.94.0.38|:80... failed: No route to host. [15:40] derp? [15:40] derp indeed [15:41] Thanks. The Xanga script needs the latest version. [15:41] oh god, they're probably on cogent [15:41] cogent has basically nulled all routing with voxility afaik [15:41] it's a bit annoying [15:41] cogent for the lose [15:41] they were complaining about "too much abuse" [15:41] but ironic given how much crap comes off cogent itself [15:41] bit * [15:42] but okay [16:51] I wrote a little bit of documentation for the Wget+Lua callbacks: https://github.com/alard/wget-lua/wiki/Wget-with-Lua-hooks [17:01] nice [17:24] this video is pretty epic http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WaPni5O2YyI [17:33] Indeed [17:50] What do people use for backups now days? I used cdr, then dvdr, and now bluray but even that is still a pain [17:50] I found out in my company's backups that some disks are bad due to a shitty drive that reported burns as good [17:51] I thought about going raid hard drives on a large scale but after the thailand floods and the cluster fuck around hard drives that does not seem as feasible [17:51] unless I waste the money on "enterprise" drives [17:52] any archivers got suggestions? [17:53] Most important is to have off-site copies [17:53] I currently don't have any backups >_> [17:53] I know that, I am asking about formats [17:54] I had a terrible crash in 96 in which I spent a month with norton disk editor recovering everything. I keep backups but I found some backups failed [17:54] I do social media data mining [17:54] 129 of the 400 backup disks have appeared to fail [17:56] https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130125/07585121787/german-court-recognizes-that-internet-connection-is-now-indispensable-modern-life.shtml heh [17:56] some of that data is proving unrecoverable and since I measure collection time in years this is a shit bag problem. [17:56] illunatic, one country down, everyone else left to go [17:57] omf__: harddisks are cheap ;) [17:57] 3tb for 100â¬, cant beat that with discs [18:00] current backup size 9.8 terabytes [18:01] and bluray disks are way cheaper, even the quality ones [18:01] hard drives it might be [18:01] I considered tape as well [18:01] blu ray isnt old enough to trust for archiving [18:02] They said the same about dvd and 10 years later my first burned dvds are still rock solid [18:02] shit it is more than 10 [18:02] more like 15 now [18:02] I am not afraid of media [18:03] Schbirid, any specific drives you recommend [18:03] lucky you [18:03] I tested a ton of shit before I commited [18:03] omf__: any, but 3 redundant or so [18:03] I tested every bluray media on the market but was stupid to trust the drive [18:03] I normally get seagates with no problems. [18:04] Does anyone else test their drives? [18:04] optical drives or real drives? [18:04] I do a 35 pass dban to flex the drive out and then a multipass badblocks to test every single sector [18:05] hard disk drives [18:05] nope, they might fail just because the day felt like an opportunity, so that is worthless imo [18:06] its a good start... [18:06] but what Schbirid said [18:06] redundancy is key. [18:07] that and have proper hard drive cooling. I have found that extends drive life quite a bit [18:07] hmm [18:07] that report google put out says otherwise [18:07] but this backup would only be on to receive updates and then be turned off [18:07] drive lifetime is weakly anticorrelated with temperature [18:08] also, most drives that die will do so quickly, so an stress-test is a very good idea [18:08] make sure you know about the bad ones as soon as possible, then rma them [18:08] interesting! [18:08] buy a few more than you need to set up your raid, rma the ones that fail the test, then use their replacements as spares for the raid array [18:08] yea, the temperature thing was surprising [18:09] there wasn't enough information for them to determine a cause, but the speculation is that the increased vibration from the fans offsets the benefit of improved ventilation [18:10] fans..... in a DC? [18:11] guess it depends what kind of chassis [18:12] now i think about it dell have a lot of fans near the hdd bays [18:12] you mean the 2007 report? [18:12] yea [18:12] yes, 2007 [18:12] though google dont have cases? [18:13] That shit is already out of date. Remember it was on older drives they ran and they held back all the really good bits [18:13] like which brands, models, lifetime ages matched up [18:13] I do not even have a drive that old [18:13] plus is it repeatable [18:14] no one else is really opening the door for us to take a peek and see [18:14] samsung drives have failed lots for us.... [18:15] you would think with an industry this old there would be more information [18:15] omf__: agreed [18:15] such as? [18:15] Dell, HP, Apple, google, facebook, etc.. all keep their yaps shut because it helps their bottom line [18:16] if you prove the unreliability of one company its a death sentence [18:16] like Packard Bell [18:16] dell rebrand drives [18:17] the upside to the whole hard disk industry is things get bigger in size and faster. [18:18] BER stays the same though [18:18] just imagine showing a SSD drive to people in the 80s [18:18] heh [18:18] yeah the error rate on the drives is not going down [18:18] there is a good recent report on that [18:19] I think we just have to live with that, and move to more reliable software [18:19] which is why I agree redundancy is so freaking important [18:19] ZFS is the way to go, I think [18:19] zfs is already old, there is some interesting new stuff coming out of netapp [18:19] even the linux support is shaping up, thanks to LLNL [18:20] if only Oracle was not Oracle [18:20] indeed [18:22] I just want to stop losing my freaking data [18:22] :) [18:22] omf__: yep :D [18:22] if it wasn't for the twitter tos I would upload all the twitter data I collected to IA [18:23] which is funny since the IA doesn't really have a backup either [18:23]