| Time |
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01:38
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turnkit |
hey @sketchcow - any chance you can get me into an alpha of the Next Gen Arnold Foundation funded search functionality for wayback machine? I know about https://wayback-beta.archive.org/ but it doesn't seem to search home page content (that search functionality was described in the archive.org blog) -- e.g. phrase searching |
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01:38
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turnkit |
ref: https://blog.archive.org/2011/06/15/http-archive-joins-with-internet-archive/ |
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01:40
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SketchCow |
HEY SO HEARD FAMAS STOPPED BY |
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01:40
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SketchCow |
THIS ONE THINKS THAT'S HILARIOUS |
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01:40
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SketchCow |
Beta is the search you're looking for |
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01:40
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turnkit |
okay. thanks. I'll leave feedback there. |
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01:42
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DFJustin |
last I heard it only indexes the front pages of domains |
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01:42
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turnkit |
that's what the blog said -- only the front / home page |
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01:43
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turnkit |
but I want to search for a phrase like "mad dog" -- it doesn't seem to work |
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01:43
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turnkit |
guess that's why it's beta. I went ahead and left a simple note. |
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01:43
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SketchCow |
Well, all I can tell you is that it's a beta. |
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01:43
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turnkit |
It's gonna be a great feature |
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01:43
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SketchCow |
Hey, this beta lacks functionality |
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01:43
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turnkit |
to be able to search the wayback machine |
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01:43
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turnkit |
too bad only front page though |
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01:44
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turnkit |
but even the front page search function -- it will open up a lot of otherwise "lost" pages |
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01:44
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turnkit |
so it's really a great thing |
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01:49
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godane |
i'm uploading 1997 nasa docs |
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01:49
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godane |
only 2872 pdfs |
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01:49
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godane |
about 9.3gb |
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01:49
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godane |
also i'm at 922k items |
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04:47
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MrRadar |
Just saw this on HN: the c2 wiki is offline |
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04:47
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MrRadar |
Lukcily someone stuffed it into ArchiveBot in July: http://archive.fart.website/archivebot/viewer/job/xdufx |
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04:48
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MrRadar |
Huh, apparently the server had a disk crash: https://twitter.com/WardCunningham/status/785960076041302016 |
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04:48
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pikhq |
MrRadar: It was also in the Archive Team mass wiki grabs at some point. |
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04:56
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* |
JesseW is somewhat concerned about better searching of Wayback data leading to increased demands for removal |
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04:56
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Frogging |
I've had this thought too |
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04:59
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JesseW |
I wish there were more user-friendly tools for making private copies of arbitrary web pages. There are lots of tools (wget being central among them), but none (that i know of yet) have the ease I'm hoping for. |
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05:51
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05:51
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swebb sets mode: +o brayden |
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05:55
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05:57
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07:05
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07:27
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07:27
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swebb sets mode: +o brayden |
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07:29
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godane |
so i found this to be interesting |
|
07:30
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|
godane |
looks like Sports Illustrated as a vault section of there site |
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07:30
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|
godane |
they go back to 1954 |
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07:31
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|
godane |
and also put issues up to 2016-09-26 |
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07:31
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godane |
very odd |
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08:28
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08:38
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09:57
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* |
arkiver is still not convinced wayback machine search will be a good thing for the web archive |
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10:08
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10:08
🔗
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Shakespea |
Hi |
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10:09
🔗
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Shakespea |
Anyone in your group archive old SDK? |
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10:09
🔗
|
Shakespea |
I was trying to find a version of the MS Platfrom SDk that still supported XP ( legacy App issue) |
|
10:10
🔗
|
Shakespea |
Also - https://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/windowsdesktop/en-US/e1147034-9b0b-4494-a5bc-6dfebb6b7eb1/download-and-install-microsoft-platform-sdk-febuary-2003-last-version-with-vc6-support?forum=windowssdk |
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10:10
🔗
|
Shakespea |
I wasn't sure if the links here were archived. |
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10:10
🔗
|
Shakespea |
(And given that this is the last version that supports anything really old (i.e VC6) , It was felt to be important.) |
|
10:11
🔗
|
Shakespea |
Archive.org wayback doesn't necessarily have a full MSDN |
|
10:11
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|
Shakespea |
for earlier contents |
|
10:13
🔗
|
Shakespea |
In any event I would strongly suggest a project ( I can't do it on the Wiki because I am currently blocked) to archive SDK, even if for various reasons it has to be a dark archive. |
|
10:13
🔗
|
Shakespea |
arkiver: Good morning |
|
10:14
🔗
|
arkiver |
hi |
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10:19
🔗
|
Shakespea |
Sorry for the monolouge |
|
10:20
🔗
|
Shakespea |
I was also trying to track down an ISO for the most recent VS Express that still supported XP |
|
10:20
🔗
|
Shakespea |
Naturally people should be using the most recent compilers but the concern from an archival perspective was ancient legacy systems built on legacy tools years ago |
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10:21
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Shakespea |
This isn't as much of an issue on GNU/Linux project as these tend to keep old package releases arounf for longer |
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10:23
🔗
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: wasn';t the latest Express version for XP the 2010 one? |
|
10:23
🔗
|
joepie91 |
if so, https://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9709969 |
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10:23
🔗
|
Shakespea |
Okay, and is that download archived for the future? |
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10:23
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|
joepie91 |
no idea |
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10:24
🔗
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joepie91 |
yeah, seems 2010 was latest for XP |
|
10:24
🔗
|
joepie91 |
2013 requires 7 |
|
10:24
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|
joepie91 |
(but is available at https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=44914 ) |
|
10:25
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|
Shakespea |
And go.microsoft.com is NOT in Wayback |
|
10:25
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Shakespea |
(due to robots.txt) |
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10:25
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Shakespea |
<Seethe> < fume> makes strange cursing sounds... |
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10:27
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Shakespea |
joepie: It's available for now, but it's now getting on 6 years |
|
10:28
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|
joepie91 |
Shakespea: right, so go collect them and upload them to IA? :P |
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10:28
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|
Shakespea |
joepie91: I will bear that in mind |
|
10:28
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|
Shakespea |
Your second link is archived already - https://web.archive.org/web/20161014102607/https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=44914 |
|
10:29
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|
Shakespea |
because I just saved it |
|
10:29
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|
joepie91 |
the download may not necessarily be |
|
10:29
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|
joepie91 |
and these things are better stored as separate items on IA anyway |
|
10:29
🔗
|
Shakespea |
That's a problem as I'm not sure how to get it saved to IA automatically |
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10:29
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: create an account, hit "upload |
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10:29
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|
joepie91 |
"* |
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10:29
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|
Shakespea |
My local bandwidth is such that I can't download many ISO's |
|
10:30
🔗
|
joepie91 |
right. have a server or something somewhere? |
|
10:30
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Shakespea |
I am just a normal net user, I don't have VPN or remote servers... |
|
10:30
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|
Shakespea |
Something else I'll have to look into |
|
10:31
🔗
|
Shakespea |
I agree with you in principle :) |
|
10:31
🔗
|
joepie91 |
Shakespea: fwiw, you can always just upload it to IA slowly |
|
10:31
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|
joepie91 |
which is better than not at all |
|
10:31
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|
joepie91 |
:) |
|
10:31
🔗
|
Shakespea |
jeopie91: True... It would be nice if there was a way to get SDK's and downloads archived without needing to do the local downaload step. |
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10:32
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Shakespea |
(Firefox doesn't exactly have a 'Save download to remote FTP...." option |
|
10:32
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|
Shakespea |
Hmm... Goes off to file a bug report... |
|
10:33
🔗
|
joepie91 |
Shakespea: closest thing is archivebot but that'll only work for the wayback |
|
10:33
🔗
|
joepie91 |
Shakespea: and what you're describing isn't really possible :P |
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10:33
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|
Shakespea |
joepie91: Does archive team have an FTP server for donations? |
|
10:33
🔗
|
joepie91 |
'donations' as in 'data to upload to IA'? |
|
10:33
🔗
|
Shakespea |
As in upload to 'dark-archive' |
|
10:34
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joepie91 |
I don't really understand the question, then |
|
10:34
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joepie91 |
like, what are you trying to accomplish? |
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10:34
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Shakespea |
What I am trying to ask for is a means to tell firefox to tell a remote server to send the file being downloaded to a third party server rather than to save it locally |
|
10:35
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|
Shakespea |
So that when Firefox starts a download , the third party server takes over and capture the download, rather than it being saved locally |
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10:35
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: that isn't a technical possibility. |
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10:36
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joepie91 |
as in, there is no way to do it with a standard FTP server, because it's just not a part of the FTP protocol |
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10:36
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Shakespea |
What's the technical limitation? |
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10:36
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joepie91 |
this requires explicit cooperation from the systems in question |
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10:36
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joepie91 |
and that cooperation isn't there |
|
10:36
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joepie91 |
(and FXP only works with FTP and only due to a weird design decision in the FTP protocol) |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: it's not a 'limitation', it just isn't a thing that FTP software is written to do |
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10:37
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Shakespea |
The alternative would be to figure out if there's a way to inform the third party site to iniate an FTP transfer remotely. |
|
10:37
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Shakespea |
(albiet based on metadata captured from Firefox) |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: there's nothing to 'capture', really. |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
it's just a URL that results in a file |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
that's it |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
bunch of HTTP headers |
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10:37
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joepie91 |
which is what WARC is for, and what archivebot saves |
|
10:38
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|
joepie91 |
but that's of no relevance when you upload something as a separate item on IA |
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10:38
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Shakespea |
So technically, the WARC should include the ISO download? |
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10:38
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joepie91 |
tl;dr there's archivebot that can archive things on your behalf, and that's about it |
|
10:38
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|
joepie91 |
but it doesn't create IA items |
|
10:38
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joepie91 |
it just adds it to the collective archivebot archives that go into the wayback machine |
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10:38
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Shakespea |
I think we may be getting confused |
|
10:39
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Shakespea |
The issue is how to ensure something that could be downloaded gets archived, without having to save it locally... |
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10:39
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|
Shakespea |
(even when the download is an HTTP/FTP transaction iniated by some sort of script) |
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10:40
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: you can't just magically make that happen. |
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10:40
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: there needs to be a system somewhere that is set up to do precisely this |
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10:40
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joepie91 |
that system is archivebot and it only does it in a very specific way |
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10:40
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joepie91 |
that's it |
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10:40
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Shakespea |
Ah |
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10:40
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Shakespea |
:( |
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10:40
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Shakespea |
Bother |
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10:40
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Shakespea |
So something get's lost because the tools don;t yet exist... |
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10:40
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Shakespea |
Pity |
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10:40
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* |
Shakespea out |
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10:40
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Shakespea has left |
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10:42
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10:42
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Shakespea |
Okay the ISO is in wayback |
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10:42
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Shakespea |
:) |
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10:43
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Shakespea |
But it's slightly convoluted how to access it :) |
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10:43
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Shakespea |
Thanks for your help... |
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10:43
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Shakespea |
Also going to file some bugzilla for firefox... |
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10:43
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10:46
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10:48
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: right, so I was going to mention: things aren't getting lost " |
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10:48
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joepie91 |
gah |
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10:48
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: right, so I was going to mention: things aren't getting lost "because tools don't exist" * |
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10:48
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Shakespea |
Okay, that was just me possibly over-reacting |
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10:48
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joepie91 |
it's just that while archivebot is useful for quickly saving a page or site, it doesn't really make sense to invest time into building such a system for miscellaneous IA uploads |
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10:48
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joepie91 |
because it would only fit a very narrow set of usecases |
|
10:48
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joepie91 |
for a very narrow set of people |
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10:49
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|
joepie91 |
while being very complex to build and maintain |
|
10:49
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joepie91 |
it's not worth the time, it's easier to just tell somebody to pay $3/month for a VPS and do their archiving from there |
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10:49
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Shakespea |
Can wget be configured to do a third party mount? |
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10:49
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Shakespea |
Assuming you have VPN setup...? |
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10:49
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joepie91 |
what do you mean? I don't think "third party mount" is an existing term |
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10:50
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Shakespea |
Server X has a file... Server Y is a third party FTP server. Server Z is me... |
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10:50
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: I think you need to spend a bit of time learning about the various protocols and how networks work |
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10:50
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Shakespea |
Can wget be invoked such that it transfers from Server X to Server X even though the wget command is invoked on Server Z? |
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10:50
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joepie91 |
because that suggestion doesn't really make sense if you understand the protocols involved |
|
10:51
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joepie91 |
and just wildly suggesting impossible things is going to drain a lot of time and attention from people who can otherwise be busy doing productive things |
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10:51
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Shakespea |
I will shut up then |
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10:51
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joepie91 |
Shakespea: I'm not suggesting that you shut up, I'm suggesting that you learn ;) |
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10:51
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joepie91 |
documentation of HTTP and network stacks is fairly widely available |
|
10:52
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joepie91 |
even just a high-level understanding of what it's for and how it works, will help answer your question |
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Shakespea |
joepie91: Okay then |
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joepie91 |
you don't need to know the nitty gritty details |
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Shakespea |
Seems I have some reading to do |
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Shakespea |
And as I've got an adequate answer... |
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* |
Shakespea away |
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Frogging |
https://search.slashdot.org/story/16/10/14/1318244/ |
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Shakespea |
Good evening |
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Shakespea |
Anyone know of UK places that will do mass imaging - https://archive.org/post/1064324/old-pc-plus-cds-and-bbc-micro ? |
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powerKitt |
Hey! I was wondering if there was a script that could go through a Tumblr tag ( https://www.tumblr.com/tagged/sbarg for example) and output the url of every user that posted in it to a TXT file. I'm an ARG archiver, and it'd really be useful if I could automate the process of finding all the old blogs of players |
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xmc |
yes we heard you in other channel |
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xmc |
powerKitt: i am not aware of such a script |
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powerKitt |
Sorry, I didn't see any responses... |
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xmc |
there weren't any but that's because nobody who is awake and looking at irc had a positive answer |