| Time |
Nickname |
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03:13
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03:35
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pnJay |
so why the two different servers across projects |
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03:35
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pnJay |
like what the hell is going on |
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03:36
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LowLevelM |
Some people are too stubborn to switch to hackint. |
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03:36
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pnJay |
okay, expanding on that |
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03:36
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pnJay |
why switch at all? |
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03:36
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pnJay |
so far as i know, efnet has been at since uh |
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03:36
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pnJay |
forever |
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03:36
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pnJay |
why hackint |
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03:37
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LowLevelM |
Because efnet has bad uptime, and no chanserv. |
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03:37
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pnJay |
what is a chanserv |
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03:37
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pnJay |
o_o |
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03:37
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LowLevelM |
When an op goes offline, then comes back, it re-ops them. |
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03:37
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pnJay |
ive never not been able to connect to efnet, but thats anecdotal |
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03:37
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pnJay |
neat |
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03:37
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Frogging |
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
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03:38
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JAA |
"Connect to any EFnet server" != "Staying connected for a long time" |
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03:38
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pnJay |
so same question other lense |
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03:38
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JAA |
EFnet has a ridiculous amount of server outages, netsplits, etc. |
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03:38
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pnJay |
why did we pick efnet |
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03:38
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Frogging |
I haven't had many issues |
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03:38
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pnJay |
like why stay |
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03:38
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pnJay |
or is it just eons of history |
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03:39
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JAA |
It's the oldest and one of the most popular networks, so it was a reasonable choice back in 2009 to coordinate the GeoCities grab I guess. |
|
03:40
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JAA |
And then I guess everyone just stayed here and never looked for a better alternative. |
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03:40
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LowLevelM |
https://www.strawpoll.me/19068933/r |
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03:40
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pnJay |
that was the pinnacle grab |
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03:40
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pnJay |
the first major warzeing |
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03:41
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LowLevelM |
Where you here since then? |
|
03:41
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pnJay |
well as an AT member who distinctly fears change, i will be in both i guess |
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03:41
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pnJay |
nah im old but not that old |
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03:41
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pnJay |
i came in around mlkshk |
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03:42
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pnJay |
well, i was on pirate bay in 2009, but didnt have morals or an understanding of dataloss in 2009 |
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03:42
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LowLevelM |
I'v been here since G- |
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03:42
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pnJay |
what a freaking grab g- |
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03:42
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LowLevelM |
google- |
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03:43
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LowLevelM |
or googleplus |
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03:43
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JAA |
pnJay: Yeah, an actual move is tricky. That's why so far no channels have really moved, but instead just (most) new channels are being created on hackint. |
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03:43
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pnJay |
we're in the awkward running-two-domain-controllers phase of the migration |
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03:44
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pnJay |
er, 3 i guess if you follow best practices we |
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03:44
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markedL |
move archivebot, then people will move |
|
03:45
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JAA |
Eh, AB is only a small part of AT. |
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03:45
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LowLevelM |
Let's continue this convo. on the hackint channel. |
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03:45
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JAA |
:-) |
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03:45
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pnJay |
that seems too much like change |
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03:45
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pnJay |
<_< |
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04:14
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Myself |
Whoah, here's one that's existed since the eGroups days, back before Yahoo acquired it! ttps://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/5ive-BsB-fanfics/info |
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12:17
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svchfoo3 sets mode: +o kiska |
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12:17
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svchfoo1 sets mode: +o kiska |
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13:17
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SootBectr |
Hello 1999. From same year I currently have a job running for geocities2 - group run by their community leaders. |
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13:21
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SootBectr |
Seems to be mostly spam though :-( |
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13:39
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Myself |
Oh yeah. You know we're in pre-1999, I'm joining groups with names like Boy_Bands_Rule and Beanie_Collectors and BRITNEYSPEARS_RULEZ. Holy crap it is a time machine. |
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13:43
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SootBectr |
I got STILL-LUV-NKOTB then stuck on a couple of their tracks, been a while since I've heard them for sure! |
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Myself |
haha |
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20:38
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Myself |
Raccoon: Have a look at the industrial machine-vision market. |
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20:38
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Myself |
Lots of new cameras are 10Gig because GigE isn't fast enough for the sensors. |
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20:39
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Raccoon |
Right. But we're also talking android universe |
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20:40
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Myself |
Well, point is, the sensors do exist. And I think any camera that's doing 4k30 must be well past a gigabit of sensor bandwidth, no? |
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20:40
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Raccoon |
yes, the sensors physically exist. the magic hardware to drive them doesn't |
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20:42
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Myself |
MIPI-CSI2 G2b pushes 2.9Gbps, and I believe that's what's in most phones. G3x gets you into the 5Gbps range. |
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20:42
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Myself |
(I'm guessing because those are the sensors that're cheapest on the aftermarket, which means they must be mass-produced.) |
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20:42
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Raccoon |
All I know is that videos don't look like photographs when you press pause. |
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20:43
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20:43
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Myself |
Sure, but that has to do with the compression that's happening _after_ the data comes off the sensor. Storage can't keep up with that bitrate so it's heavily compressed. |
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20:43
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Raccoon |
and definitely not the resolution |
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20:43
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Myself |
Photos can be buffered and stored more slowly so they can keep more of the data. |
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20:43
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Raccoon |
i doubt the hardware is pumping 30 megapixels of video data anywhere |
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20:44
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Raccoon |
that's getting butchered right at the sensing |
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20:44
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20:44
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Raccoon |
Video: you monster. |
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20:44
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Myself |
I disagree quite strongly. Most sensors don't do any compression of their own, they can only do decimation and framing. |
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20:44
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Video |
what |
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20:44
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Myself |
The compression is happening at the other end of the CSI link, typically in dedicated hardware in the SOC. |
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20:45
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Raccoon |
compression? no. throwing away pixels, yes. |
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20:45
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Video |
@Raccoon: what do you mean "you monster" |
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20:45
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Myself |
Usually not. It's easier to run the link at full speed the whole time the camera's active. This lets you do things like use the full resolution for image stabilization even if you're decimating after that. |
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20:45
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Raccoon |
Video: talking about how cellphone camera sensors and drivers butcher the image frames being captured while in video mode. BUTCHERED i say. you monster. |
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20:46
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Video |
oh |
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20:46
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Myself |
If you decimate before stabilization, you get more artifacts from the IS process. |
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20:46
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* |
Raccoon shrugs |
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20:46
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Video |
i thought i was evil for using hexchat |
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20:46
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Raccoon |
looks like throwing away pixels to me. |
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20:47
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Raccoon |
instead of passing all 16 x 16 pixels to the driver, it's just passing the top-left corner pixel, or an average of all 256 pixels in that block. |
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20:48
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Raccoon |
why the hell would it process all those bits when none are going to be saved to disk |
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20:48
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Raccoon |
er, only one will be saved |
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20:49
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Raccoon |
i'd even bet on it just reading the corner pixel of every x/y scaled block because it's much cheaper. |
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20:54
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20:55
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20:55
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X-Scale` is now known as X-Scale |
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21:02
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Frogging |
At least use a DSLR. If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right. |
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21:05
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Raccoon |
Frogging: conversation stemmed from the idea of scanning magazines using a cellphone camera with android software to detect page turns and stillness |
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21:05
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Raccoon |
some apps exist, they use video-mode, it sucks. |
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21:06
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Frogging |
Phone cameras tend to be shite in general |
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21:06
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Raccoon |
put one on a tripod with good lighting and it can do better than a flatbet scanner, faster |
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21:06
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Raccoon |
with less page bleed |
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21:07
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Raccoon |
though i suppose some flatbet scanners are just cameras now |
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21:09
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Frogging |
I'd opt for a DSLR with good lighting and a remote trigger, personally. But that's just me |
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21:09
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Raccoon |
why do people still use mechanical DSLR cameras? isn't that like holding into vinyl? |
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21:10
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Frogging |
because phone cameras are designed to be small and light and the thus laws of physics limit their quality? |
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21:10
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Frogging |
thus the* |
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21:10
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Raccoon |
I'd kick any photographers out of a press conference room who didn't use pure solid state silent cameras |
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21:13
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Myself |
Yes and no. Through-the-lens viewfinder is valuable in low-light conditions, where a sensor-preview viewfinder really struggles. |
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21:13
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Myself |
I had both mirrorless and DSLR, and the mirrorless was worthless in low light. I got rid of it because the DSLR, albeit bulkier, could do everything it could do but not vice-versa. |
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21:14
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Raccoon |
digital eyeball tube viewfinders can/do exist |
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21:14
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Myself |
I'm not familiar with the term |
|
21:15
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Raccoon |
if the whitehouse banned noisy cameras, camera makers would offer dual support for a preview screen and a viewfinder screen that blocks out environmental light |
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21:15
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Raccoon |
la eyeball tube |
|
21:15
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Frogging |
I have such a camera already |
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21:16
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Raccoon |
does the camera make flip-flop clicky sounds? |
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21:16
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Frogging |
It has a mechanical shutter, but it's mirrorless |
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21:16
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Myself |
Oh, yeah I've used those. That still doesn't make the sensor any better as a viewfinder in low light. It simply doesn't have the gain at the short exposure times you need for viewfinding. |
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21:17
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Frogging |
But yeah, that's not the issue in low-light |
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21:17
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Raccoon |
sounds like the photograph would be doomed to failure then |
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21:17
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Raccoon |
i want to see what i'm going to get |
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21:17
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Raccoon |
not see reality and then get a grainy image when i develop them at home |
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21:17
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Frogging |
A mirrorless proper camera would still work better than a cellphone |
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21:18
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Myself |
Your armchair quarterbacking was entertaining for a while but I'm losing interest in someone telling me I don't do what I do do. |
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21:18
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Frogging |
because the lens and the sensor are bigger |
|
21:18
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Frogging |
more photons, more data, less grain |
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21:18
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Myself |
bigger pixels means deeper photon bins per pixel means more dynamic range |
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21:18
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Raccoon |
Frogging: fair. i was just talking about a software driven solution that cuts out a lot of work, but yes, you're correct in that respect. |
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21:19
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Frogging |
With the right mounting and a remote actuator, it would not be much work at all |
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21:19
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Frogging |
turn page, press button |
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21:19
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Frogging |
repeat |
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21:20
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Raccoon |
I picked up a $500 brother and I'm debating sawing off the spine of a book and feeding it through the copy hopper. it does straight-to-pdf with normalized page sizes |
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21:21
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Raccoon |
will see how that turns out for time and effort |
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21:21
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Frogging |
My experience with page hoppers is it somehow ends up being slanted |
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21:21
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Frogging |
I don't know how to mitigate that |
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21:22
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Raccoon |
will have to see how smart it is. maybe they have alignment software |
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21:22
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Frogging |
Maybe I'm not setting the paper clamps properly? I don't know |
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21:23
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Frogging |
Though it's not a high end model and I don't scan books |
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21:23
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Raccoon |
think i may need a belt sander for this |
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21:26
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Frogging |
It's amusing though when people are impressed at the megapixels on a phone camera. Yeah, there are lots of pixels, but zoom in and you'll find that all those extra pixels are just sampling noise |
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21:26
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Frogging |
:p |
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21:27
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JAA |
Let's make the pixels even smaller so that we can bump the resolution even higher! |
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21:27
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JAA |
Higher is always better! |
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21:27
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Frogging |
it's like converting your 128kbps MP3s to 320kbps for "moar quality" |
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21:27
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Myself |
What gets me is, okay, theoretically you should be able to sum and average those adjacent pixels to get back to the same effect as larger pixels, right? The noise should average out, the quantum efficiency should be the same... |
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21:28
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Myself |
Only the higher percentage of sensor area occupied by inter-pixel frame space should go up, and that's compensated by microlenses |
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21:28
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Myself |
But for some reason it doesn't work like that and I've never quite gotten my head around why. |
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21:28
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Frogging |
Yeah but you're not increasing the amount of data you're not adding anything meaningful to the resulting image, other than artifacting from the averaging |
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21:36
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Frogging |
The extra post-processing can only increase the entropy |
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21:37
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Myself |
That's fair enough. All other things being equal, a single larger pixel will always be better. |
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21:45
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22:37
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ivan |
https://slickdeals.net/f/13721480-14tb-wd-easystore-external-usb-3-0-hard-drive-209-99-free-shipping |
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22:38
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JAA |
Goddammit. Meanwhile, the same-ish price for 8 TB is the cheapest it's ever been here in Switzerland. :-| |
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22:39
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JAA |
Almost worth considering a freight forwarding service at these prices. |
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22:41
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JAA |
I guess these are the new 14 TB Reds? |
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23:09
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23:14
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ivan |
the drives in the easystores are flashed to run at 5400 RPM |
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23:15
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ivan |
sometimes the cache is also reduced |
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23:16
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JAA |
Ah yeah, different firmware, right. Has anyone ever tried flashing the Red firmware onto them? |
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23:17
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ivan |
probably a very bad idea |
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23:18
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ivan |
the firmware has block mapping stuff and they may have been binned 5400 RPM for a reason |
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23:21
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JAA |
True |
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23:21
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JAA |
But actually, Reds are 5400 rpm anyway? |
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23:21
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Myself |
rpm influences flying gap and thus format density, don't change the rpm on a modern drive! |
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23:22
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SootBectr |
There's Red Pro 7200rpm models |
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23:23
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JAA |
Correct, but I said only "Red". |
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23:25
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SootBectr |
OK |