#archiveteam 2012-03-31,Sat

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Time Nickname Message
03:00 πŸ”— underscor https://twitter.com/#!/lewiscollard/status/185916679757365248
03:27 πŸ”— underscor http://i.imgur.com/RxyBm.png
03:28 πŸ”— underscor bonus points for guessing where I started downloading mobileme
03:28 πŸ”— underscor :D
03:36 πŸ”— Coderjoe probably someplace you shouldn be?
03:36 πŸ”— underscor I meant where in time
03:37 πŸ”— Coderjoe especially when it quadruples usage
03:37 πŸ”— underscor but that might be true too
04:40 πŸ”— kennethre lets do this
04:41 πŸ”— SketchCow Welcome
04:41 πŸ”— kennethre how many mobileme instances would be ideal?
04:42 πŸ”— underscor 42000
04:42 πŸ”— kennethre haha
04:45 πŸ”— kennethre i'll do 50 for now
04:45 πŸ”— kennethre alard: where's that script again?
04:45 πŸ”— kennethre i think the app i have laying around is out of date
04:49 πŸ”— kennethre " Didn't get a client id. Sleeping for 60 secondsҀ¦" :(
05:05 πŸ”— lemonkey http://techcrunch.com/2012/03/30/jordan-mechner-creator-of-prince-of-persia-finds-original-source-code-in-his-dads-closet/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Techcrunch+%28TechCrunch%29
05:23 πŸ”— SketchCow Oh, that thing I'm flying to LA to work on?
05:52 πŸ”— underscor SketchCow: you're actually flying out there to help?
05:52 πŸ”— underscor That's cool
06:53 πŸ”— yipdw OT but great: http://serverfault.com/questions/293217/our-security-auditor-is-an-idiot-how-do-i-give-him-the-information-he-wants
07:06 πŸ”— nitro2k01 (That link) WIN!
12:18 πŸ”— emijrp ShoutWiki wikifarm is probably dead http://shoutwiki.com/ (no response in the last month). #WikiTeam (nemo_bis) took a copy in August 2011 http://archive.org/details/shoutwiki.com.
12:25 πŸ”— * BlueMax salutes the Wiki Team
12:38 πŸ”— emijrp Knol, one month to the shutdown.
13:37 πŸ”— godane i got scientific tuesdays from rev3
13:37 πŸ”— godane hd ones too
13:37 πŸ”— godane thats about 3.1gb
13:42 πŸ”— ersi http://hackaday.com/2012/03/31/floppy-autoloader-takes-the-pain-out-of-archiving-5000-amiga-disks/
13:42 πŸ”— ersi ^_^
14:40 πŸ”— human39 So, I have various music stuff i was involved with when I was a teenager. Rock 'n roll type stuff mostly. I was thinking of dumping it into IA. I'm kind of confused where these should go? I'm not sure if it's really considered a "netlabel"
14:50 πŸ”— SketchCow human39: Technically, it's "open source music"
14:50 πŸ”— SketchCow Is it a lot of music?
14:50 πŸ”— SketchCow Or, I should say, items? With an item being an album of music.
15:16 πŸ”— balrog_ph SketchCow: How is it best to deal with recorded music that's probably still within copyright but extremely obscure to a point where the original authors/producers no longer exist and that won't get reissued probably ever?
15:16 πŸ”— ersi Copy it, upload it
15:17 πŸ”— balrog_ph Is this the case with scores too?
15:18 πŸ”— balrog_ph My idea was a nice system using mediawiki to keep everything organized
15:18 πŸ”— balrog_ph But ofc that's more work
15:36 πŸ”— ersi If you make it public, you're going to get torn a new asshole probably in due time
15:36 πŸ”— ersi As in a web site or so
15:38 πŸ”— tef balrog_ph: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orphan_works it's a fun fun fun fun legal agea
15:38 πŸ”— tef area
15:38 πŸ”— balrog_ph tef: I know
15:39 πŸ”— balrog_ph In this case it's obscure enough that I don't think it's THAT dangerous
15:41 πŸ”— tef balrog_ph: label them as such, make sure you have contact information for rights holders to contact you and request a takedown
15:41 πŸ”— tef should be enough to cover your butt but IANAL
15:41 πŸ”— balrog_ph Yeah I know
15:41 πŸ”— tef cool :-)
16:28 πŸ”— SketchCow kennethre: Hooray, looks like Readibility is not going to jail
16:28 πŸ”— kennethre SketchCow: hah, new news?
16:29 πŸ”— SketchCow Shame it took an asshole like Gruber to fix that.
16:29 πŸ”— SketchCow Yeah, the highjacking of links made gruber-pushed news (Benjamin Brooks, too)
16:29 πŸ”— SketchCow So they switched things
16:29 πŸ”— kennethre yeah i was all over that yesterday
16:29 πŸ”— SketchCow Naturally, people are complaining because it broke a ton of things.
16:29 πŸ”— kennethre he railed into them
16:30 πŸ”— kennethre My thoughts were...
16:30 πŸ”— tef http://utf-8.jp/public/aaencode.html *head explode*
16:30 πŸ”— kennethre "Readability isn't run by scumbags, but I do sincerely believe that the concerns people are raising people are very real."
16:30 πŸ”— kennethre "They're fantastic guys with great intentions, but they're moving too fast. Everything's a reaction. The blog post today is a testament that."
16:30 πŸ”— kennethre "You have to take time to do things properly. To reflect on what you're building and why. It's why I left the company."
16:30 πŸ”— kennethre "Transparency."
16:31 πŸ”— SketchCow Oh man, I hadn't seen that Anil Dash has his nutsack in all this.
16:31 πŸ”— kennethre i think he's typically buddy buddy with them
16:32 πŸ”— SketchCow He's called a "Readability advisor"
16:32 πŸ”— kennethre ah yeah
16:32 πŸ”— kennethre so glad i left :)
16:32 πŸ”— SketchCow This was a big year for me - three times people I have fucking roasted publically didn't even TRY to engage me at events.
16:32 πŸ”— SketchCow Anil was one of them. Saw me, walked right past
16:32 πŸ”— SketchCow \o/
16:33 πŸ”— kennethre Hahahaha
16:33 πŸ”— kennethre you're too quick with your tongue to engage
16:34 πŸ”— kennethre (in a good way)
16:34 πŸ”— SketchCow Well, beating people down verbally is a specialty
16:35 πŸ”— SketchCow Don't worry, the kind of people who hand-wring themselves to death over a long pause have taken time to tell me I catch more flies with honey
16:35 πŸ”— SketchCow I point out you catch even more with a flamethrower.
16:35 πŸ”— tef hahah
16:36 πŸ”— kennethre readability is almost purely in the business of having press
16:37 πŸ”— kennethre we almost actually waited several hours to push a release to production so someons' buddy at CNN could run their story on it
16:37 πŸ”— kennethre i suspect they won't recover well from yesterday, but we'll see I guess
16:39 πŸ”— SketchCow Sorry we stol ur moneys
16:40 πŸ”— SketchCow Fact. If you hold money 'for' someone, you hold it FOR YEARS
16:40 πŸ”— SketchCow And then LATER, you DETERMINE THE FUTURE OF IT
16:40 πŸ”— SketchCow You don't decide, oh, 365 days? That's a random number we decided now represents free monies we get to keep
16:41 πŸ”— SketchCow You're already getting interest at the bank
16:41 πŸ”— SketchCow Which can be significant
16:41 πŸ”— kennethre And best yet, you say so.
16:41 πŸ”— kennethre I feel like the whole fiasco could have been avoided by a simple bulleted list
16:42 πŸ”— kennethre "We do X with unclaimed money."
16:44 πŸ”— kennethre "When you share a link, this hapens."
16:44 πŸ”— SketchCow My new favorite phrase when talking to someone is "Oh, make no mistake, you're going to go to jail"
16:44 πŸ”— SketchCow Amazing how that changes the tenor of the conversation
16:44 πŸ”— kennethre how often can you fit that into conversation?
16:44 πŸ”— SketchCow Anyway, yeah, I was delighted that people have figured out not to engage.
16:45 πŸ”— SketchCow I talk to a lot of people who are going to jail
16:45 πŸ”— kennethre lmao
16:45 πŸ”— balrog_ph Seems I missed something interesting...
16:45 πŸ”— SketchCow So, Amazon S3 for free guy is running into static/friction
16:45 πŸ”— SketchCow So we'll see if that changes
16:45 πŸ”— balrog_ph What's going on?
16:46 πŸ”— SketchCow Free S3 stuff
16:46 πŸ”— balrog_ph Not going so well? :/
16:46 πŸ”— SketchCow Well, it's not a "going" thing
16:46 πŸ”— SketchCow He's going to ask and get an answer
16:46 πŸ”— balrog_ph I see
16:46 πŸ”— balrog_ph I wouldn't expect anything...unfortunately
16:47 πŸ”— kennethre SketchCow: link?
16:54 πŸ”— kennethre http://cl.ly/2I471r433P3q082r0z12
16:54 πŸ”— kennethre sigh
17:43 πŸ”— Nemo_bis and that ShoutWiki copy is up-to-date, because the wikis were put in read only...
18:59 πŸ”— human39 SketchCow, starting out, one comp, so one item for now. I have a number of others, but I don't think they amount to more than a couple of handfuls of "items".
19:11 πŸ”— ersi Woot, what is this talk about Readability?
20:10 πŸ”— yipdw kennethre: when you're around, I'd like to talk to you re: httplib.BadStatusLine and robust ways to debug the problem
20:10 πŸ”— yipdw I figure you're the biggest Python person here
20:16 πŸ”— DFJustin human39: "community audio" is kind of the grab bag
20:17 πŸ”— kennethre ersi: http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/03/30/readability
20:17 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: honestly that's something i don't run into very often. what's causing it now?
20:21 πŸ”— yipdw kennethre: I'm really not sure; I've just managed to track the exception as resulting from here -> https://github.com/ArchiveTeam/ffnet-grab/blob/client/retrieve.py#L165-167
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw it could be the tracker
20:22 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: http://python-requests.org :)
20:22 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: takes a lot of that stuff into account
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw yeah :P
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw I saw that after I wrote most of retrieve.py
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw the API seems, uh
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw less overengineered
20:22 πŸ”— kennethre should be pretty easy to switch
20:22 πŸ”— kennethre haha yes :)
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw I think I will
20:22 πŸ”— kennethre (that's my library)
20:22 πŸ”— yipdw yep :P
20:23 πŸ”— kennethre so quick answer
20:23 πŸ”— kennethre make sure you're sending a host header
20:23 πŸ”— yipdw aaaaactually
20:23 πŸ”— yipdw it could very well be the tracker
20:23 πŸ”— yipdw I'm running with a prerelease version of Rubinius and Puma
20:24 πŸ”— yipdw i don't often use non-released code in production, but when I do I do it throughout my whole fucking stack
20:24 πŸ”— yipdw might as well switch the client to requests, if only for fun
20:24 πŸ”— kennethre i encourage this :)
20:26 πŸ”— alard yipdw: It's also good to add a "Content-Type: application/json" header.
20:26 πŸ”— yipdw to the request?
20:26 πŸ”— yipdw oh hmm
20:26 πŸ”— yipdw I am indeed not adding that, oops
20:26 πŸ”— tef kennethre: oh I found a 'bug' in requests but I fixed it by not being stupid
20:26 πŸ”— kennethre tef: what was it?
20:27 πŸ”— tef you can make a GET request with a body attached
20:27 πŸ”— tef which is invalid, but many servers won't complain and drop the body
20:27 πŸ”— tef iirc on the invalid part
20:28 πŸ”— tef could be wrong mind, but tbh I was expecting an error locally saying 'no body allowed on get requests' or silently dropping the data part
20:28 πŸ”— kennethre tef: it's actually not invalid, but the default api doesn't provide a 'data' argument
20:28 πŸ”— kennethre tef: but if you use requests.request('GET', Ҁ¦) directly it'll let you
20:28 πŸ”— tef ah yes I am doing the latter
20:29 πŸ”— kennethre yeah that api makes no assumptions
20:29 πŸ”— tef like I said, I fixed 'the bug' by not being stupid
20:29 πŸ”— kennethre you can send a ARCHIVE request if you want :)
20:30 πŸ”— yipdw I like that you can do that via XMLHttpRequest
20:30 πŸ”— yipdw at least in Gecko, haven't tried it elsewhere
20:30 πŸ”— yipdw one day I will write a webapp that uses profanities for methods
20:48 πŸ”— philpem guys, can I have your opinion on something? -- the current draft of the DiscFerret file format: www.discferret.com/DFIFileFormat_20120331.pdf
20:48 πŸ”— philpem I'm basically looking for suggestions on what it should store, and how.
21:09 πŸ”— emijrp 1.1M tweets of superbowl http://r-shief.org/dan/superbowl_twitter.zip
21:26 πŸ”— chronomex philpem: seems good so far
21:27 πŸ”— chronomex philpem: I've got a book called "magnetic recording" by Lowman; suggest you buy a copy if you're going to be doing much work with tape or disk
21:27 πŸ”— chronomex philpem: is DFI also going to be usable for tape archiving?
21:28 πŸ”— philpem I wasn't intending it to be used for tapes, but it could be extended to do so
21:28 πŸ”— philpem you'd end up splitting things into "blocks" rather than "tracks", "heads" and "sectors" though
21:29 πŸ”— chronomex tapes have tracks and heads and blocks, which is kind of like tracks and sides and sectors.
21:29 πŸ”— philpem hm, ok, then in that case you could store it -- and add a metadata block to identify it as being a tape image
21:29 πŸ”— chronomex anyway, if you allow for more than 2 sides, the format becomes more widely useful with little change needed
21:29 πŸ”— chronomex yes
21:29 πŸ”— chronomex "sides"
21:30 πŸ”— philpem it already does allow for more than two sides -- the identifiers are 32-bit.
21:30 πŸ”— chronomex how do you plan to encode the data?
21:30 πŸ”— chronomex ah, excellent!
21:30 πŸ”— chronomex flux transition timing, as seems to be the best current method?
21:30 πŸ”— philpem exactly
21:30 πŸ”— chronomex hmmm
21:31 πŸ”— philpem it stores two blocks of data: the Timing Delta Block (which contains the transition timings) and the Index Offset Block (which stores the location of any index pulses which were detected)
21:31 πŸ”— yipdw kennethre: converted that script over to requests, seems to be going fine so far
21:31 πŸ”— philpem TDB is compressed, IOB is not
21:31 πŸ”— chronomex aye
21:31 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw; :D
21:31 πŸ”— philpem well, let me rephrase that, TDB "can be" compressed.
21:31 πŸ”— yipdw I like how it eliminated code in a 4:1 ratio
21:31 πŸ”— yipdw or more
21:32 πŸ”— philpem generally bzip2 but lzma, lzo and gzip also have compression format IDs
21:33 πŸ”— chronomex philpem: right.
21:33 πŸ”— philpem bzip2 and gzip are mandatory, lzma and lzo are optional.
21:33 πŸ”— chronomex how is this format different from the DRAFT system being designed by the Kryoflux people?
21:33 πŸ”— balrog_ DRAFT doesn't exist
21:33 πŸ”— balrog_ it was announced a long time ago
21:33 πŸ”— philpem mine actually has publicly available documentation :)
21:33 πŸ”— chronomex not at all?
21:33 πŸ”— balrog_ their current STREAM is a joke
21:33 πŸ”— balrog_ I haven't seen it
21:33 πŸ”— balrog_ not seen it == vaporware/nonexistent
21:33 πŸ”— chronomex well, balrog_, yes STREAM is not an archival format
21:33 πŸ”— chronomex ok
21:34 πŸ”— chronomex well then!
21:34 πŸ”— chronomex fuckem
21:34 πŸ”— * philpem grins
21:34 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: that's the goal :)
21:34 πŸ”— balrog_ I mean seriously, how long does it take? :/
21:34 πŸ”— balrog_ chronomex^
21:35 πŸ”— chronomex balrog_: to publish a file format? nfi.
21:35 πŸ”— balrog_ to design and implement and publish
21:35 πŸ”— balrog_ one file per track is clunky
21:35 πŸ”— balrog_ :<
21:35 πŸ”— yipdw kennethre: though, I am bit uncomfortable with the fix, because I don't really understand why I was getting that BadStatusLine exception in the first place
21:35 πŸ”— chronomex depends on the problem you're solving!
21:35 πŸ”— yipdw the tracker logs show no errors server-side
21:35 πŸ”— yipdw so I guess it's a client thing, but hell if I know why
21:35 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: probally missing `host` or `accept` headers
21:35 πŸ”— yipdw hm
21:36 πŸ”— kennethre requests has taken a lot into consideration :)
21:36 πŸ”— yipdw weird exception to raise :P
21:36 πŸ”— balrog_ chronomex: an unpacker solves that
21:36 πŸ”— yipdw I mean, I'd expect something like MissingAcceptHeader or whatnot
21:38 πŸ”— chronomex philpem: I would enjoy working on this with you.
21:38 πŸ”— kennethre yipdw: nah, different servers do drastically different things
21:39 πŸ”— balrog_ chronomex: freenode, #discferret :)
21:39 πŸ”— chronomex freenode? :|
21:39 πŸ”— balrog_ yes, freenode, what's wrong with it?
21:39 πŸ”— chronomex it's not efnet
21:43 πŸ”— tef heh
21:48 πŸ”— balrog_ efnet doesn't have chanserv, which means miscreants can take over too easily :/
21:49 πŸ”— chronomex efnet is my home
21:50 πŸ”— Soojin buy raspberrypi and have xchat running 24/7
21:50 πŸ”— chronomex wrong solution. use shellserver, irssi.
22:23 πŸ”— yipdw hmm
22:23 πŸ”— yipdw 87 examples, 0 failures, 7 pending
22:23 πŸ”— yipdw Finished in -98664708.0478 seconds
22:23 πŸ”— yipdw I think something may be wrong
22:23 πŸ”— tef maybe
22:23 πŸ”— chronomex nah, looks good
22:26 πŸ”— yipdw yeah, my superluminal computer is awesome
23:31 πŸ”— Wyatt|Wor I've got a tarball that seesaw-s3 is having trouble uploading-- curl's getting 500 errors from batcave and it's down to 33 retries. Known issue?
23:52 πŸ”— Wyatt|Wor Completely unrelated to the above, but I'm curious. SketchCow, how resilient are Apple II floppies in terms of data recovery?
23:55 πŸ”— Wyatt|Wor The Prince of Persia thing is amazingly cool, but at the same time, I'm given the impression that twenty-five years is a long time for magnet-coated plastic.
23:55 πŸ”— chronomex it is
23:56 πŸ”— Wyatt|Wor (Though isn't tape pretty much the same thing? What makes that more-suitable for archival?)
23:57 πŸ”— chronomex nothing, it just historically has a cost advantage
23:57 πŸ”— Wyatt|Wor Aah
23:57 πŸ”— chronomex best format for long term storage is holes punched in tyvek tape or cards
irclogger-viewer