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SketchCow |
https://internetarchive.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Software_Library |
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Vito` |
and then the wayback will ingest the wiki, and eventually the wiki will go offline, and people will pass around wayback links to saved wiki pages like samizdat |
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DFJustin |
WHAT FORSOOTH, PRITHEE TELL ME THE SECRET WORD |
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DFJustin |
thx |
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16:05
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SketchCow |
bai: Yes indeed, once again screenshotting is a nightmare shitshow |
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16:06
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SketchCow |
One of my things broke, and the whole house of cards came crashing down, so I tried Chrome (fail) Brave (fail) Newest Firefox (fail) and now back to regular firefox and so on and so on |
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16:06
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SketchCow |
and so on and so on and so on I can't wait for the earth to burn |
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16:07
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bai |
ah, is the screenshotter built on seleniun? |
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16:11
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SketchCow |
ha ha FUCK NO |
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16:11
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SketchCow |
NOOOOOOO |
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16:11
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SketchCow |
ooo |
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16:11
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SketchCow |
oo |
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16:11
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SketchCow |
Dude, I will turn a beloved household pet inside out before I learn a new scripting language |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
Oh man, do i need another reason to hate people in a specific place |
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16:12
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bai |
sockington noooo :( |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
I take simple screenshots of firefox |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
But |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
BUT |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
See |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
Firefox is smrt |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
super smrtr |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
Don't wanna run as root |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
That's bad |
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16:12
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SketchCow |
So they just clicked in a bunch of random "hey, you're running as root" checks |
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16:13
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SketchCow |
And it broke all my shit |
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16:13
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SketchCow |
So now it's just a game of how is jason going to shim-jam open his ubuntu instance here so it fucking runs anyway |
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16:13
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SketchCow |
But make it something that blows up half my day |
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16:13
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16:15
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SketchCow |
Oh it gets better |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
The thousand error messages/warning |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
I look them up |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
Bug report |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
By dozens of people |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
discussing it |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
for years |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
because mozilla |
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16:15
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SketchCow |
YEARS |
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16:16
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SketchCow |
Like, do your one ridiculous job |
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16:16
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SketchCow |
Your one simple job |
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16:16
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SketchCow |
make a browser |
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16:17
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bai |
yeah my experience with bug reporting against firefox is, if you report a bug in a complex system a mozilla employee will say "sounds pretty bad" then sit on it for 2 years until you boil it down to the simplest possible test case, then they'll fix it in 30 minutes |
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16:18
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bai |
my experience with chrome is "just don't even" |
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16:18
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SketchCow |
And here we are. It's a half day later and I am so much directly exactly where I stood 3 hours ago you could overlay them by transparency and it'd be that exact. |
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16:18
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SketchCow |
I again can get firefox to run as root, go to a display in an X server, and take screenshots, all of which fail. |
|
16:19
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|
SketchCow |
So that's ... good, I guess. For a while I had it completely broke-ass |
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16:19
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SketchCow |
Made a new script now called FUCKFIREFOX |
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16:19
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SketchCow |
Which will do a test for me to help me find the problem |
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16:20
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SketchCow |
I mean, the main issue is I'm running a slightly out of date ubuntu |
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16:20
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16:21
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SketchCow |
14.04 |
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16:21
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SketchCow |
You know |
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16:21
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SketchCow |
the old times |
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16:21
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SketchCow |
3 years ago |
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16:22
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SketchCow |
This bumps into "Internet Archive can't just give me a new instance" |
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16:22
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SketchCow |
Amazon can. |
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16:22
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SketchCow |
But then I'm spending money, real money |
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16:55
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DFJustin |
wow they fix things for you if you make testcases? I still get the 10-year sit |
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16:56
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18:09
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TSCHAK |
. o O (the more projects I stick my head into, the more I realize that it's just bad all over...) |
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18:13
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18:14
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bai |
yeah, it's a constant battle between "we have a system which mostly works using the old ways of doing things, do we keep propping up the old wonky stuff or do we bite the bullet and retool for all the shiny new hotness which probably comes with its own set of crappiness?" :D |
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18:15
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bai |
DFJustin: guess I just caught a dev on a good day :D |
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18:16
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bai |
I reported a problem with es6 modules failing to load my pure-JS doom port, they triaged it as a webgl thing and sat on it until I boiled it down to a three-file example showing how it affected a certain usage pattern for using imports and exports together |
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18:21
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19:33
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ted |
terrible |
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19:33
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ted |
(all software) |
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19:34
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balrog_ is now known as balrog |
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20:15
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SketchCow |
I'm back, by the way. |
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20:15
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SketchCow |
It helps to understand I go to bed 2-3am as usual, but then Rachel makes me wake at 7:30am to take her to the bus and that wrecks my day to begin with, so I try to get a little bit going before the inevitable crash |
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20:15
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SketchCow |
Only this time it was screenshot horseshit. |
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20:42
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SketchCow |
Where I am now. |
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20:42
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SketchCow |
Can run Firefox as root again. |
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20:42
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SketchCow |
Can screenshot. |
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20:42
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SketchCow |
However, for some reason, it does the load and then goes to a blank screen. |
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20:43
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SketchCow |
First going to see if we didn't introduce something crazy with new MAME stuff. |
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20:45
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20:46
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SketchCow |
OK, so |
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20:46
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SketchCow |
DOSBOX works. |
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20:46
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SketchCow |
Works fine in fact. |
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20:51
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SketchCow |
OK, so |
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20:51
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SketchCow |
It just blew up because of WebGL |
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20:51
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20:53
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bai |
oh? |
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20:53
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bai |
did they switch the default output to webgl or something? |
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20:54
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SketchCow |
Oh buckle up, give me a moment, I'm screenshotting for you |
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20:55
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bai |
I know the way emularity works, it wants to write things like loader progress, etc. onto the same canvas using 2d canvas api, which is fine if you're using 2d canvas api for mame/dosbox output because it just takes control of the canvas context - but if the app is configured for opengl output, that causes problems because you can't just turn a canvas with a 2d context into one with a 3d context without |
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20:55
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bai |
recreating it |
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20:56
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SketchCow |
Exception thrown - GLctx is undefined |
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21:01
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SketchCow |
Yeah, so it blows up. I installed gtx, still blows up. |
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21:01
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SketchCow |
going to try another version of firefox. |
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21:03
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SketchCow |
OK, so all my versions of firefox explode now. |
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21:03
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SketchCow |
Something changed int he compilation. |
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21:03
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SketchCow |
db48x: hey hey |
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21:06
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SketchCow |
I just paste it to db in the slack. |
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21:08
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21:13
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DFJustin |
there's a firefox config to turn all the webgl stuff off |
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ted |
we use something for testing, i think llvmpipe? https://www.mesa3d.org/llvmpipe.html |
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SketchCow |
Back |
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22:34
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SketchCow |
Ok, we got the problem nailed down a bit more |
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ted |
unrelated but i gave my notice today, i'm leaving mozilla soon |
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SketchCow |
! |
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SketchCow |
What's your thing there |
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db48x |
ted: !! |
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db48x |
so I tested the WebGL problem, and it's currently only affecting the apple2e emulator that I uploaded the other day |
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db48x |
that one is based on MAME 0.206, and the rest are still from MAME 0.205 |
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db48x |
but I also upgraded Emscripten at the same time, so that might have caused it |
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db48x |
as I understand it, MAME just uses SDL, and Emscripten's SDL port tries to use WebGL and falls back to the 2D apis if that fails |
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db48x |
but maybe they took out the fallback |
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SketchCow |
Should I hit the alon button |
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23:26
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DFJustin |
mame has a couple different output methods and I'm not totally sure which is the default |
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23:27
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db48x |
SketchCow: it might be worth asking him if this is a known problem, or a deliberate feature :) |
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db48x |
DFJustin: it says that it's "using SDL multi-window soft driver" in the console |
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db48x |
ok, I must eat lunch. bbiab |
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DFJustin |
ok that's -video soft |
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DFJustin |
you can also try -video opengl or -video bgfx |
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bai |
hmm, I don't think that fallback happens on the emscripten side, my understanding is that you can configure mame with different output drivers, I think in the past to get opengl output I'd use the bgfx output option |
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DFJustin |
but that's not the goal I guess |
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bai |
maybe the default changed |
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DFJustin |
my bet would be something changed with emscripten's sdl port |
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bai |
also possible |
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SketchCow |
https://twitter.com/kripken/status/1093995738571300864 by the way |
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SketchCow |
Also, someone has a solution: "All pixels are now absolute-positioned divs." |
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SketchCow |
Get on that |
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SketchCow |
Also, I pinged alon, to see if he'll show up |
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kripken |
hi SketchCow |
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SketchCow |
Hey, man. |
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SketchCow |
18:23 < db48x> so I tested the WebGL problem, and it's currently only affecting the apple2e emulator that I uploaded the other day |
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SketchCow |
18:25 < db48x> as I understand it, MAME just uses SDL, and Emscripten's SDL port tries to use WebGL and falls back to the 2D apis if that fails |
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SketchCow |
18:25 < db48x> but maybe they took out the fallback |
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SketchCow |
18:27 < db48x> SketchCow: it might be worth asking him if this is a known problem, or a deliberate feature :) |
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kripken |
hmm, is that SDL1 or SDL2? |
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kripken |
I don't think we changed anything in SDL1 recently (no new development there), and I think SDL2 only supports GL anyhow |
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SketchCow |
Also: That new Chrome WASM cache is f'in ridiculous, is firefox getting that |
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DFJustin |
sdl2 |
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kripken |
Would be best though to ask in an issue in https://github.com/emscripten-ports/SDL2/issues , Daft-Freak is the main developer on that code |
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kripken |
I don't remember any fallback path being taken out, but there have been a bunch of changes - could be a bug |
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kripken |
SketchCow: I know firefox wants to implement it too, now sure of status though |
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SketchCow |
It's literally a game changer |
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SketchCow |
We weren't going to overcome the cache limit and then they go ahead and implement a specialized cache limit |
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kripken |
specialized cache limit? |
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SketchCow |
Yeah, the WASM compile cache doesn't care about the made-up file limits all the browsers use for files in general. |
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SketchCow |
I'm flinging 5mb+ WASMs at it and they just go in. |
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SketchCow |
Not AS useful for special one-off WASMs like an arcade game |
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SketchCow |
But for the computers and consoles, bip bip |
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kripken |
oh good, nice |
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SketchCow |
So once you load AN apple 2 WASM in Chrome, every time you use it again, the loading of the wasm/compile is instant |
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SketchCow |
And since the datafiles are 140k, those are barely noticable |
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kripken |
great, glad to hear this works so well! |
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SketchCow |
https://twitter.com/kripken/status/1098727361598480387 |
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SketchCow |
Assume you meant this as a DM |
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SketchCow |
But I like it without context |
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SketchCow |
As did a random other |
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kripken |
heh i must have hit the wrong button on my phone |
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kripken |
deleted |
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SketchCow |
o no |
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SketchCow |
So, to summarize |
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SketchCow |
- Happened with new emscripten |
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SketchCow |
- No other factors seem to be in case |
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23:58
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SketchCow |
- Basically, fallback doesn't happen |
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23:59
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SketchCow |
- We like that it's doing new things but it should pour a 40 for fallback |
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23:59
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SketchCow |
- db48x should do an issue |
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23:59
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SketchCow |
Is this all correct? |