#archiveteam-bs 2017-12-23,Sat

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WhoWhatWhen
icediceHey ez, are you sure hosting on Marshall Islands is even a thing? Nothing on https://www.peeringdb.com/advanced_search , http://www.datacentermap.com/datacenters.html , and the very few Marshall Islands web hosts listed on Google just seems to be based in the Marshall Islands and rent servers in the US.
They can't even maintain their own TLD: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.mh
[00:00]
JAAicedice: #archiveteam for announcements, #archiveteam-bs for lengthy archival-related discussions, #archiveteam-ot for anything else. [00:02]
icedicehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communications_in_the_Marshall_Islands#Internet
ok
moving the discussion there
[00:02]
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jacketchaYou should try to host on Kahoolawe if you're looking for a far away island
I'm pretty sure there are a few hundred people there
Don't mind the radiation
[00:22]
icediceI'm guessing the US nuked the shit out of that and the inhabitants now glow in the dark [00:25]
jacketchaProbably
I think I have some relatives there
If not there, try Mauna Kea
You can power your servers with hundreds of peltier devices
[00:26]
icediceSure, get them to set up a box that connects via satellite and we have a web host :P [00:26]
jacketchaDon't even need a satellite
Hawaii is one of the chokepoints of the internet, kinda like Norway
[00:27]
icediceAh, right [00:27]
jacketchaAnd yet, Hawaiian Telcom STILL can't get their modems to have a normal settings page with port forwarding [00:28]
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icediceMy friend and I are currently hosted in a DMCA free data center in Luxembourg [00:28]
jacketchaJust be careful, Germany is getting nationalistic again [00:29]
icedice(We have an ad free non-profit fansite that hosts some stuff that is long out of print, but still copyrighted, as well as some newer stuff) [00:30]
ezicedice: luxembourg implemented EUCD in 2004
if anybody tells you otherwise, its marketing BS
[00:31]
icediceIt's DMCA free though [00:31]
ezDMCA applies only to US
anywhere in EU, you have EUCD
[00:31]
icediceAny request would have come via Luxembourg's legal system [00:32]
ezexcept for perhaps switzerland, which has its own process for copyright strikes [00:32]
icediceYeah, but lots of foreign web hosts still obey and enforce DMCA [00:32]
jacketchaWe have strict copyright, but at least we have good fair use laws that nobody listens to except the people protected by it.
Rest in peace fair dealing
[00:32]
icediceAnyway, the people owning the copyright most likely know we exist and we have never gotten a legal notice from them [00:33]
JAA#archiveteam-ot please. [00:33]
icediceHell, two people from those companies even use the site
I'll stop now
[00:34]
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jacketchaNow that's what you call good public and private relations [00:34]
Hey, how many of you have seen https://pastebin.com/rFAgdLWD
It's one of the top trending pastes right now
And I think they pulled it off
oh well
[00:46]
JAAStill works for me.
Ah you mean that.
[00:49]
jacketchaBut bitcoin is taking one of the biggest hits [00:50]
JAAMeh, the decay started earlier than that, didn't it? [00:50]
jacketchaNo, this is the second time I've seen this paste [00:50]
JAAHm [00:50]
jacketchathe first one was seen by way more people
I think they're trying to kill the bubble
[00:50]
JAAThe date is interesting for sure. [00:50]
jacketchaYeah, it started going down around wednesday
I think my archiving extension grabbed the first one
[00:51]
ezjacketcha: i've seen better
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/277984429081624577/393814757766987786/1lciqvoynf501.png
arguably one of the best bitcoin memes atm
[00:52]
JAAHehe [00:53]
jacketchalmao [00:53]
JAAjacketcha: Nope, started earlier than that as well. Business Insider's markets tool has the maximum on Sunday.
http://markets.businessinsider.com/currencies/BTC-USD
Can't seem to extract the accurate timestamp from that though.
And the stronger decay started around Tuesday.
[00:54]
jacketchaYeah, I'm on bitcoin.com right now for their charts
At this rate, they'll be able to sell bitcoin for the steam holiday sale soon.
[00:55]
JAAAh, that's just daily rates, right. [00:57]
jacketchaYeah
I need to start logging it every 10 seconds
[00:57]
JAAI want to do statistical analysis on that, like determining when the exponential growth of the last few months was first deviated from statistically significantly.
Anyway, getting off-topicy again.
[00:59]
jacketchayeah
Does the internet archive keep a copy of bitcoin's price though?
I think I'll set that up
should be pretty easy
around every 30 seconds should be fine, right?
[01:01]
done [01:14]
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ezjacketcha: theres no singular "bitcoin price". there are archives of individual trade feeds, though - https://bitcoincharts.com/about/markets-api/
all the markets are very shallow/high spread so its difficult to establish a precise price at any given moment
[01:25]
jacketchaOf course there is no single price for bitcoin, such as there is no single price for bread. There is a common range of prices, and very big cryotocurrency market places though that report their price. I am using bitcointicker.co for my price origin right now\ [01:30]
ezyea, that just displays the feed
what i mean that if you want to mirror historical data, just mirror bitcoincharts feed for history, and then you're better off pulling the exchange api yourself
screenshotting any given website will give you very inaccurate/out of context (meaning: useless) data
[01:31]
jacketchaTrue, I'll take that into the script
Would it be even better to take multiple sources as well, not just bitcoincharts?
[01:33]
ezbitcoincharts is the only one giving out public history, but they themselves generally discourage using their live feed
the site is often quite overloaded as p much all trade bots are pointed at it
(meaning, bitcoincharts is *the* archive of historical price, but it would be nice to have another one)
[01:34]
jacketchaI'll look into that [01:36]
ezif there was something archiving bid/ask orderbooks as well, that would be really nice, as far i know nobody archives that
but its generally important metric on the depth of the market through history
[01:37]
jacketchaWell, thanks random fearmongering paste, now I have a winter break project\ [01:37]
ezthe paste is so ridiculous i suppose thats why its shared. of ridiculous cryptocurrency shaenigan pastes, this one takes the crown https://pastebin.com/CcGUBgDG
while fake, i really wish it was real
[01:38]
jacketchaprotip: if you want to look serious when baiting, sign your message with pgp
You know, with pastebin getting around 2 pastes per second, I wouldn't doubt that the majority of all human knowledge has made it in there
[01:40]
ezpastebin would probably deserve some sort of archive bot, yea
archiving it amounts to archiving 4chan though, the bot operator would have to constantly deal with the same legal takedown barrage pastebin gets
[01:42]
jacketchaI have an idea [01:43]
godaneso i found my last recorded vhs [01:43]
ezperhaps keep the archive log delayed/darked for a year or so, and then publish it [01:43]
jacketchaEncrypt each paste and wait for its copyright to expire, then decrypt it [01:44]
eznobody generally gives a shit about what was going on before
jacketcha: copyright?
[01:44]
godaneits has dust on the top but has no white mold [01:44]
ezits rarely about copyright
just the usual - slander, harassment, dox and stuff
is what disappears from pastebin pronto
also leaked passwords and what not
[01:44]
jacketchagood point
ive made somewhat of an effort to archive at least the new pastes
using the liveweb feature
[01:44]
ezpastebin are real asses about scraping
they have pay-to-scrape api
[01:46]
jacketchaikr [01:46]
ezand public scraping is limited, you cant hammer it at the rate new pastes appear sadly
needs to cycle at least 10 or so proxies
[01:47]
jacketchaSo, I made a chrome extension that is basically the equivalent of !ao, but it runs on every page you visit
and i get banned from pastebin
alot
Good thing VPNs exist
[01:47]
JAAI think joepie91 was looking into Pastebin archival with that previously mentioned $$$ API a while back. [01:49]
ezdepends whats worth more, $20 for scrape pass, or your time to make your script proxy aware [01:50]
jacketchaI'm broke, so I'll take proxy aware
At least multiple people can run it then
as long as they know how to install node packages
[01:50]
ezi'd first check if they dont ban tor already tho
as tor is one of the few rare "legit" proxies, any other proxy is shady one way or another
[01:52]
jacketchai wonder if i can just use IFTTT
they're a big name
and it's easy to use them as a proxy as long as you don't expect a response
[01:53]
ezyes, ifttt can make http requests
these tools are incredibly cumbersome for anything serious, even as simple as scraping pastebin
[01:54]
jacketchayeah
wait
does the internet archive use a proxy while using liveweb?
[01:55]
JAADon't.
:-P
[01:55]
ezwhy would they?
the crawler uses ia ips, if thats what youre asking
[01:55]
jacketchaalright, because most of my crawlers use liveweb, because me too poor to afford a dedicated server for warc storage, and me too stupid to learn how to use google drive api [01:56]
ezhmm, im not sure what save page extension actually does
i imagine it would be simpler to just save whats already downloaded by the client
[01:56]
jacketchait saves the page without resources [01:57]
ezeven if that introduces trust issues [01:57]
JAAI wrote a little script for peeking into WARC files without having to decompress the entire file, in case anyone's interested: https://github.com/JustAnotherArchivist/warc-peek [01:57]
ezjacketcha: google drive is too pricey anyway [01:58]
jacketchanah, i got a school account [01:58]
ezah [01:58]
JAAI thought those extensions just open web.archive.org/save/<current URL>. But there are several, and I don't know all of them. [01:58]
jacketchathey do
but mine just makes a get request
[01:58]
JAAAnything else would be pretty dangerous really.
Dangerous for the integrity of the archive, that is.
[01:58]
jacketchahttps://github.com/jacket-chan/auto-archive-extension [01:59]
JAAAh :-| [01:59]
ezJAA: on another hand, it would allow for archiving walled content
but as you said, trust issues
[01:59]
jacketchagood point [01:59]
JAAYeah [01:59]
jacketchai think im gonna reverse engineer how WARCreate works and just steal that
thank god for open source
[01:59]
ezjacketcha: theres also archive.is you can abuse for this too
archive.is is slightly better as it seems to run true headless browser, while ia archives seem wonky
[02:00]
jacketchatrue [02:00]
eztho not sure about save page, im judging by public crawls [02:00]
jacketchaI used that for archiving 4chan pages before I knew about archiveteam
just archive the archive.is page and you're good to go
[02:01]
JAAThe save page "just" serves the live page, attempting to rewrite every URL it can find to web.archive.org/save/...
That works well for many things and not so well for just as many things.
In particular 99% of JS-based requests will probably fail.
[02:01]
jacketchaThat sounds eerily similar to what I would have done [02:02]
ezjacketcha: 4chan got its own fleet of mirrors
no need to save threads
[02:02]
jacketchatrue\
but they're all blocked for when I want to read greentext in the middle of infotech
[02:02]
eztho no mirror is as crazy to keep all the pictures iirc
i know the guy who runs 4plebs
[02:03]
jacketchadoesn't 4chan upload the images to imgur? [02:03]
ezand its like, 40tb just the thumbnails [02:03]
jacketchaoof [02:03]
JAAs/crazy/ambitious/
;-)
Look at us, we were trying to save 1.4 PB of Vidme videos. :-P
[02:03]
jacketchalol
so me and my friend at school decided at the beginning of the year we're going to race to fill our google drive accounts with one petabyte
and I got 6.1tb in before I got contacted by IFTTT because I had made more than a million requests per hour to the google drive API using their service
[02:04]
JAAThat sounds... inefficient. [02:06]
jacketchaextremely
but, as I said before,
[02:06]
JAAJust use Beaston02's scripts if you're serious about that challenge. That should get it done in a few weeks or so. [02:07]
jacketchajacketcha is too stupid to learn how to use any of Google's APIs and OAuth [02:07]
ezJAA: 4chan is far bigger than, sadly.
400GB a month
thats after deduping
[02:07]
JAA(That's the guy who hoarded > 1 PB of webcam porn on Amazon Drive until they discontinued the unlimited plan.) [02:07]
jacketchalmao I remember that [02:07]
ezJAA: ouch [02:08]
JAAez: Uh, that doesn't sound right.
14 years * 12 months per year * 400 GB per month = ~67 TB
[02:08]
ezJAA: thats just one, but most active board [02:08]
jacketchais that /b/, /pol/, or /r9k/ [02:09]
ezpol, but b and r9k together are archived too
and tehy together are probably as big as pol
[02:09]
jacketchawait, /pol/ is bigger than /b/? [02:10]
JAAjacketcha: The AT wiki has a nice compilation of the 4chan mirrors by the way. [02:10]
ezi dont have numbers for the rest, but taken together 4chan should be something to the tune of 2TB a month
jacketcha: by far. only as recent tho
[02:10]
JAASo ~300 TB total for the past 14 years (at most, as it was probably less active in the early days?). That's big, but not *that* big. [02:11]
jacketchanot CERN "hey if you want to download collision data here's the link" on twitter big [02:11]
ezJAA: just thumbnails. nobody really knows number for full scrape as nobody archives those for longer than a year [02:12]
JAAOh, I see. [02:12]
jacketchaI'm surprised this isn't one of the biggest targets, seeing how 4chan is probably on some of the shakiest grounds known to any site, but is the birthplace of memes. [02:13]
JAAShouldn't be too hard to scrape a few thousand threads and estimate total size from that. [02:14]
ezhm, 4plebs apparently doesnt have archive.moe archives
guess it would be nice to start mirroring the boards somewhat more consistently
all the archives seem to be truncated to between 1-4 years
[02:14]
jacketchayeah [02:15]
ezarchive.moe was huge, like 10TB and seems to be still lost [02:16]
jacketchai wonder if it could be pieced together with the cache of really old computers [02:17]
ez2015-09-19 4plebs Purge (Archived!) - Removing full images older than 18 months (before April 2014) as of September, 2015, due to low storage space. Obtained the data, now working to upload the whole set to the Internet Archive.
oh
so thats why
they dumped their full sizes to IA
[02:17]
jacketchaoh
So, is the IA just the cold storage unit of the internet?
[02:17]
ezp much [02:18]
jacketchalike, even I do that sometimes
upload a file to a temp file host like uguu.se and just archive the file
then bam, instant file hosting
So, is the archiveteam twitter dead?
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jacketchaHey, where is the logs of the IRCs stored? Because I can guarentee that the logs of a channel for archivists will definitely be kept somewhere [03:18]
JAAhttps://www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=IRC#IRC_Logs [03:23]
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jacketchaThank you [03:23]
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godaneso i may have ton of buffy episodes from season 6 [05:20]
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godaneWOC episodes [05:20]
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SketchCow: so i maybe able to fix the gap of buffy episodes that was taped over in your boxes
my one last tape has S06E04 to S06E07 so far
that tape you had was label to have S06E06 to S06E12
but it was all taped over but part of S06E12 at the end of tape
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godanedo we have that: https://thepiratebay.org/torrent/18471513/The_Journal_of_Organic_Chemistry_(JOC)[1936-2017]_upd_20.08.2017 [08:30]
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ezwhich reminds me
suppose there was a way to get hands on huge stash of sci-hub scrapes
how exactly one goes about getting those into IA?
those would indeed need to be darked immediately, springler would send their law ninjas immediately otherwise
[08:51]
schbiridyou mean the papers? would be great to spread them amongst everyone with some kind of anonymous collection sharing thingies [08:55]
ezits been tried before
it didnt work well
these collections are really huge
schbirid: https://sites.google.com/site/themetalibrary/library-genesis ... libgen is a lot like AT
just more rawwr, piratey
[08:55]
schbiridyeah the torrents are not well seeded :( [09:00]
ezideally it would be nice to have ia as seed
for as long as possible
[09:01]
schbiridnot gonna happen [09:03]
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Harzileinsome day i'd like to make a proposal for nntp seeds ;)
libgen used to be posted to usenet, but apparently that stopped somewhere in the 700k range
[09:06]
ezyea, its sort of a problem finding home for all of that
but its kinda radioactive, being sci-hub affiliated and all
you cant post on usenet at this rate, especially not at the pace of sci-hub scrapes
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[11:28]
IglooAnyone else having issues with uploading to FOS? [11:36]
jacketchaI'm going to pretend I know what that stands for even though it is probably something very obvious.
Yes.
[11:38]
IglooDNS lookup fos.textfiles.com [11:38]
jacketchano dns records or txt records
runs ubuntu
ssh 2.0
and seems to be related to the internet archive and archiveteam]
so probably important
[11:39]
IglooName: fortressofsolitude.textfiles.com [11:40]
jacketchaoh [11:40]
IglooIt's an ingress point for a lot of our "stuff" [11:40]
jacketchacool name
what's as7941?
[11:40]
IglooBGP AS number [11:42]
jacketchaInteresting [11:43]
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jacketchaoh wow it's 2:26 in the morning
I should probably go to bed
gn
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joepie91JAA: ez: jacketcha: https://pastebin-stream.cryto.net/ [13:31]
JAANice! [13:36]
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schbiridhttps://www.reddit.com/r/DataHoarder/comments/7lkwx6/over_2tib_of_old_scene_game_releases_now_complete/ [14:38]
Lavernenice. Grabbing it now, thanks for linking [14:52]
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SketchCowFOS should be up [15:05]
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ezjoepie91: neat [17:39]
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JAAWho runs purplebot (the bot that announces wiki changes in here)? PurpleSym? I just noticed that my changes to the Blog.pl page from yesterday didn't get mentioned here. Perhaps something broke due to the server upgrades? (Cc jrwr) [17:53]
PurpleSymJAA: Yep, that’s mine as well. And yes, the wiki update seems to have killed it. I’ll have a look. [17:54]
JAAThanks [17:54]
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PurpleSymHuh, for some reason python-requests double-encodes the pipe character in request parameters: https://www.archiveteam.org/api.php?action=query&rcdir=older&format=json&continue=&rcend=1513853996&rcnamespace=0%257C6&rcprop=user%257Ccomment%257Ctimestamp%257Csizes%257Ctitle%257Cflags%257Cids%257Cloginfo&rclimit=500&list=recentchanges [18:11]
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godaneSketchCow: i'm uploading 10gb of qvc japan i capture over the last few days
also please don't upload the /QVC Japan/2017-12 folder until i tell you too
mostly cause i may lose power during my uploading
everything but that folder is uploaded
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JAAjrwr: svchost01 is having a stroke. ^ [21:08]
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[22:44]
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